I knew when I wrote my last entry that I would catch some flack in the Comments!!
I have problems when I write for the general public. I want to put out helpful information for all kinds of gamblers – both low-denomination players and higher ones – for recreational players and serious advantage players – for video poker enthusiasts and slot mavens. My advice is that if some subjects don’t fit your style of playing, just skip over them and wait for one that does.
I also do not want to alert casinos to techniques that can be used to increase player advantage. That is the reason that I often do not name specific casinos or give every single detail about why we play at a certain time at a certain casino. You will have to trust me that if you see us playing VP, we have found a reason – or, more likely many reasons – that this is a good play. Often there is a promotion that has been advertised that everyone knows about but I have found additional benefits that may not be generally known: coupons that not everyone got in the mail – perhaps for locals only; good bounce-back amounts; tier benefits; local extras that out-of-towners don’t get, etc. (For the record, I do NOT count comps when I figure the total EV of a play although they do have value. We consider them “gravy,” ABOVE the mathematical real money advantage. That is why I called the cruise a “bonus.”)
There are other considerations. Sometimes we play very heavily on one day rather than spread out play over many days. This is often important in casinos that send benefits that depend heavily on “daily average.” Although we usually play the best EV we can find in a particular casino, sometimes we will opt for a lower EV if we need to put a lot more coin-in through and the better EV games are in lower denominations. When we were younger and healthier we could pound on a machine all day long – and if you can do that, you might be able to go with the highest EV you could find.
Remember in a previous entry I talked about the big difference between 9/6 JoB and 8/5 Bonus. I haven’t forgotten that! And you need very big extra benefits to bump up 8/5 Bonus to make it a positive play. But these opportunities do come along ever so often. You just need to do the math carefully and realistically to be sure you do have an advantage!
And one last concept that I am forced to repeat for the slow learners: despite its misuse, “frugal” does not always mean cheap – or playing only low-denomination VP. It means getting good value for your money – AT ANY LEVEL.
If you are truly frugal when you start gambling at quarters, as we did, and never play unless you have the advantage, in 26 years you might be able to play $125 a hand, like we sometimes do now – and still be considered a “frugal gambler.”
Jean
I’m just wondering what you think about casinos that require, or rather want, your SS# when you sign up for their players card? And that you are supposed to give it out loud at the desk? Of course, they also want your phone number and when you say that you don’t want to receive calls as it is a cell, they say you can check the box to not receive calls. Well, then why do you want my phone number? The casino I am referring to is Hollywood Casino in Lawrenceburg IN. I am not really comfortable giving out my SS# right off the bat…need to know basis in IMHO…please let me know what you think of this and if other casinos do this as this was the first one we have run into…TIA!
If you want to spend the time and energy there are ways to improve your game. i wouldn’t want to spend the time and energy and drive to play that often. I play once or twice a week at a local casino and have won my share of jackpots but I have NEVER won a major prize. The casino i stay away from is SOUTHPOINT! They have full paying VP but the machines are VERY TIGHT!!!!!!!
LUKE,
I like to hear about Jeans trips to casinos, Good or bad. Her tips have moved my wife and myself up to the point we have never paid for a casino room or most meals.
I think you wish you had her skills and yes LUCK.
PUT US DOWN FOR THE NEXT BOOK.
My dear Mrs Scott,
I totally agree with your definition of “frugal”.
I started the video poker learning process when I first realized there was a thing called strategy. Thanks to you, Skip Hughes, Dan Paymar, Lenny Fromme, Bob Dancer and Michael Shackleford. I’ve never invested in a book so my learning has probably taken longer than those who chose to invest. However, I was able to get different takes on strategy quite frugally. A big thanks to vpfree2 for letting me find the best EV games at the casinos where I will play.
Thanks to you I learned about comps. Once again, I never invested in a book but let the internet guide me. That being said, I would have to recommend “The Frugal Gambler” to those that don’t like to surf.
I have never had the bankroll, time or the inclination to be an “advantage” player (professional). I have learned that a low-roller, with enough play, can get service from a host simply by asking. I’m realistic in my expectations and am happy with the comps I get. Low-rollers can get all the information they need online to maximize their play. Instead of whining about this blog, get after the information and help yourselves become “Frugal” gamblers. Don’t expect to be an “advantage” player unless you have the bankroll and time to invest!!! Do maximize your fun by getting free rooms, food and drinks.
Thanks for being willing to share a little of yourself with us Mrs Scott. I certainly hope that You and Brad continue to have good fortune in all that you do..Rich
Luke, I doubt very much that she was “bragging”, as you put it. First of all, she’s won many, many prizes and drawings over the years, and quite a few of those prizes have been much bigger than a cruise. Second, as she says, she was one of fifty people who won a cruise, so she didn’t do anything particularly unique or special. The point of her post–which has seemingly zoomed right over your head–is that things do eventually turn around; losing streaks don’t last forever. Also, simply persevering–as in, hanging around for the cruise drawing–is often the key to winning.
In any case, if you want to talk about “helpful information”, none of YOUR posts have contained one iota of that.
Jeans says (above) about writing for the general public, “I want to put out helpful information for all kinds of gamblers….”
However, Jean’s 5/29/10 blog entry contained no helpful information at all. None. It was just an excuse to boast about winning a cruise.
Bragging is not necessarly a bad thing. Some people (apparently) like to hear it.
But, seriously, Jean. Telling us that it was intended to be ‘helpful information’ to someone is BS.
Just admit it….you were bragging!
Jean, by your statement”do the math” do you mean using the return percentage (available from Bob Dancer’s seminars, for example) and adding the percentage pay back from the players card club? What else?
As I sure you’re aware, Jean, most available high-denom plays are lower EV than the best .25 plays. In fact, even a positive .25 multi-line game is a rare bird. At the mid-roller range–say, $5-$25/hand–the -EV kills most plays, even with bounceback and other benefits: the casinos have considered those players its most dangerous, so they’ve carefully constructed a schedule of diminishing returns (you might get enough bounceback to make a $10K/month play +EV, but you probably won’t get five times as much bounceback if you play $50K, thus making the heavier play lower, and possibly negative, EV). Above that level is the true high roller, which realm you seem to have entered at plays of $50-125/hand. With that kind of play, you may indeed get perks that ordinary mortals don’t—but they would HAVE to be over and above cashback, bounceback, and comps. So you can’t count on, or even accurately quantify, those “over and above” benefits. I believe you when you say that those over and aboves are enough to drag your play into +EV territory–but I’m also sure that your plays are high variance, and very thin positive EV.
I’m saying all this in order to emphasize that your current playing experience is so radically different from that of just about all your readers, that those readers find it hard to relate to. Perhaps you should return to your .25 denom always +EV roots for a while, and tell us how we can survive on $5,000 coin-in per day, and maybe even make a profit. And yes, you’ve told us that before, but the conditions that were prevalent when you wrote your books no longer exist. It might be time for an updated assessment, from the point of view of the low-roller.
Thanks, Jean. And in referring to one or two of your most recent articles, I’d appreciate your opinion on the concern that some of your bloggers have (including myself) that casinos can reprogram machines to pay less. In other words, can they reprogram so that the paybacks are the same, but perhaps quads or something else show up less often, or does the Nevada Gaming Board get involved at that point?
Hi Jean,
Well put,but then you are you such a great VP commentator which is why I hope there is another book in your future.
George