I’ve borrowed the late Merle Haggard’s 1981 song title to describe a conversation video poker players have heard hundreds of times. It’s often expressed as an argument where the premises go something like the following:
- Video poker pay schedules aren’t nearly as good as they used to be.
- Casinos have slashed their slot club benefits.
- Casinos do not offer promotions as lucrative as they used to.
From those premises, the conclusion usually becomes: Might as well hang it up. Video poker is simply not worth playing anymore.
It’s hard to argue with those premises. On average they are quite true. Occasionally a casino will add a looser-than-normal game for a while, (sometimes by mistake!), but the usual situation goes the other direction.
The thing is, I’ve been hearing this same argument for almost 30 years. And every time, players have been longing for the “Good Old Days.” But a number of video poker players continue to prosper. My entire video poker career has occurred after I first heard that the game isn’t very good anymore.
The argument is especially valid if they want to go to the same casinos they always have gone to, play the same game, and receive the same benefits. If they’ve been playing for more than a little while, that situation is basically impossible.
Sportsbook players say that if you only have one out (i.e., one place to bet), you can’t win. The lines have enough built-in cushion, and the bookmakers are good enough, that a player won’t have the edge. To win in that game, you have to have a variety of outs where there are different odds at different places. The same is true in video poker.
If you only know one game, and can’t or won’t learn another, you run out of options fast. If you know a variety of games, and are willing to play in a number of places, you can still find opportunities.
You might want to consider some or all of the following:
- Visit other casinos than you’re used to. Out of town or out of state, if necessary. (For me, I play more coin-in outside of greater Las Vegas, where I live, than I do close to home.)
- Learn other gambling games. (For me, this has been advantage slots. Your mileage may vary.)
- Increase and utilize your network of other successful gamblers. Nobody knows everything. If you have information that is useful to me, I might well have information that is useful to you. I’m not interested in a one-way sort of communication unless I’m getting paid well for it.
- Consider changing stakes. Sometimes better games exist for higher or lower stakes than you normally play. Playing for lower stakes than you’re used to isn’t as exciting, but it can make sense.
- Consider non-gambling activities. I certainly am not doing all of the same things as I was ten years ago. Are you? There are myriads of things you could be doing.
Finally, if it’s time to quit…quit. Not because somebody else thinks you should, but because you think you should. (Well, spouses can have a pretty big vote in these things.) At different times, I fancied myself as a backgammon player and as a blackjack player. I quit both of those because I came to the conclusion that I wasn’t going to be a financial success at either game. I’ve dabbled at sports betting and live poker and am convinced that they are not the games for me either. I’ve also quit various organizations through the years when I felt I had outgrown them, or they had outgrown me.
A quitting strategy actually makes sense. Decide what would have to happen for you to no longer be a profitable video poker player — and if and when those conditions arise, quit. Go do something else with your life.
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The video poker pickings have gotten slimmer, for sure. But there are many casinos that have playable video poker, but they won’t be found on the strip and most are for lower denominations. The same can be said for blackjack. The casinos have moved away from having gaming as the main focus for fleecing their visitors. Casinos now make the majority of their money from food, rooms, rip off resort fees, paid parking, bottle service, concerts/ entertainment. And the new generation of “gamblers” would rather watch cartoonish non cerebral video games as they enjoy their overpriced drinks. I say enjoy video poker while you can, it won’t be around much longer. I will now get off of my soapbox.
Any chance you can do a GwaE on advantage slots?? Be nice to know what type of games to look for essentially for a vp break. Thanks!
Ditto on David Miller’s response. One of the necessary questions someone like Mr. Dancer must ask is, “If I were at the card level and comp/cashback level of me when I was 25, could I make a reasonable profit playing video poker?” It’s kind of asymmetric when someone of Mr. Dancer’s current standing and statuses attempts to give advice to we video poker plebes.
I’ve come to the conclusion that Las Vegas has slowly filtered out most of what I loved about the place while emphasizing everything I dislike.
If it’s something you enjoy doing then I think it still can be very rewarding and slightly profitable. I think Bob’s co author on the Winner’s Guides, the late Liam W. daily, even stated he was comfortable being a smart recreational gambler and taking advantage of all the perks. He was not looking to make a living on video poker.
But unless you can eat cruises and sleep in free food, you are not going to earn a living playing video poker. The days of the grannies playing full pay deuces wild at minimum wage to supplement their Social Security are over. I don’t begrudge people like Bob not sharing what they know to make sure they can continue to make a living, although I do strenuously object when he or others try to stop other people from choosing to share what they found out on their own to whomever they choose. For example, my local casino, Yaamava, has a 1.1% promo on Wednesday mornings up to $10000 coin in. There are 98.9%+ games widely available. Is that going to be a good opportunity for the recreational gambler? Yes. Should a professional come and play it for a few bucks positive EV? No.
I also don’t have the time or patience to check slot machines for advantage plays. I will always check Ultimate X machines nearby and clear off multipliers left on the machine, but I will not roam the casino and sit next to people and play them like a piano just to find every single multiplier around. But if one were doing it for a living, one might find it necessary. It is the equivalent of the folks checking the trash cans and picking out the cans and bottles. Absolutely profitable, but also a lot of effort.
Calwatch I am 100 per cent with you.
As a tourist visiting Las Vegas for more than 30 years, at least 2x per year (except the Covid times), I can list a few things of interest to underlgn some facts that even tourists have noticed and cannot be happy about:
Just about 15-18 years ago, the Palms (if my time spectrum is accurate) used to have that legendary bank of full pay deuces wild with progressive meter for the Royal Flush.
The American Casino Guide Book as well as the Las Vegas Advisor used to be filled with coupons that you could only dream of. I recently received my 2023 coupon book by LVA. I bought it despite the fact that shipping costs were outrageously high and Station has removed all buffet vouchers. Just 10 years ago, that LVA book was so valuable that some idiots started making copies of the coupons to even increase the value and that’s maybe one of the reasons why some companies no longer participate in the program.
I remember the Fiesta on Rancho used to have promotions that were so good that I played all day on my favorite games. Rampart used to be great with full pay games in it and now is just a shadow of itself. Suncoast as well.
I think even the Skyline on Boulder Highway South has remodeled the joint a way that the Deuces Wild Corral no longer exists. It was full of 100.76 per cent games, which was always great in combo with its legendary shrimp cocktail.
The Jokers Wild Casino has removed the 99.90 per cent DDB Game which never gave me a royal flush although I played there always on Sudays because of the good promotions and the relaxing atmosphere (the beverage hostess remembered me for years and knew what I wanted to drink and it never changed (awesome)).
The Tropicana Casino on the Strip and the Terrible’s Casino on Flamingo (now Silver 7) used to offer a rebate program for new sign-ups. And the program was really good at the beginning. They changed that over the years until it finally was suspended. I think other casinos had a similar program, some of those places I could play because I didn’t have a players card there at that point.
Even the Mirage used to have buffet coupon in that book , so I played in the poker room during the times when that place was the No 1 spot for poker (in the early 90s?).
Even the stateline casinos used to have attractive games that made it worth going there on a day to chill out, do some shopping in the outlet mall and then play a little bit of videopoker.
At this time I get tired of listing more points but I definetely have more in my memory.
What leaves today is a city that has become too big because of tax reasons in California (maybe) or because people like it there so much.
The 1199 Dollar threshold has never been modified and adjusted although inflation since the 80s till today would cry for a rise of threshold long time ago. 5000 would be a fair amount. Not so sure what this is not happening but it definetely keeps me away from playing 1 dollar or 2 dollar games as they take off 30 per cent disregarding the fact how much I have been losing by the time I get a hand pay. Every serious player will agree with me that under such conditions play is not recommended.
So, after all, Vegas is still my top tourist destination, but things have changed tremendously. Let’s find out and watch how long it takes until the last resorts will blink and do their final adjustments. My call is that the Southpoint will also start removing more and more of the good games and replace these games on the floor. From what I noticed, that trend has already begun.
From Switzerland
Boris
The D (Fitzgerald?) had a whole section of great antiqe games on the 2nd floor. All these games are gone.
The Tuscany used to have a 98.90 per cent progressive DDB game in the front right by the entrance. That was yesterday.
The Mirage had buffet voucher in it, 2-for-1, and the Palms had a 50 per cent dicount coupon in it, up to 50 Dollars. It was great to go eat at a good price and go gambling deuces wild machines after that.
The El Cortez, along with the Vegas Club where the last 2 places that were offering a few machines with Downtown Deuces, and the points were given at the same rate a slot player was earning. And they had multiplier days for Videopoker many days per week.
The 2-for-1 coupons at the Station buffets at the beginning were good any day of the week, until they changed it and only accepted them several days midweek. It comes along with the heavy reduction of good videopoker machines and at the same time the permanent increase of that ridiculous resort fee.
What remains today is not much compared to what was the situation 20 years ago. No matter how you look at it.
Not a single casino named with VP schedules. Not a single AP game named and of course zero strategy advice how to play the said AP game. I gleaned nothing again from this article because nothing was shared. Bob will cash his check however….SMH
I know I’m not in Bob’s target audience but I do enjoy his column and perspective. I’m a low denomination player that knows most time I’m going to lose money. I play video poker for the enjoyment of the game and getting a royal flush now and then. I go to Vegas once a year and play the crappy pay tables on the strip at the video poker bars. A cold beer and video poker is a fun way to spend a day in Vegas for me.
David ,Talk to Kevin Lewis. He will cheer you up¿
David Sabo’s comments led to my wry smile.
I was going to let this slide, but…
Mr. Dancer trotting out some alleged sportsbook truism about not being able to win if you use just one book is a tad lame. It’s like saying you won’t lose weight eating every meal at McDonald’s every day. If something goes without saying, then why say it?
When I was a teen, I did some reporting for the local paper. Maybe, like me, Mr. Dancer gets paid by the column inch.
I also would like to know what and where the “advantage slots” are, and whether there’s something that has to be currently true or that we have to do in order to play them when they are in “advantage mode” [my term]. The term “advantage slots” used to be an oxymoron; slots, by definition, always had a bigger house edge than video poker; slots never returned over 100%, while VP often did. So . . . . . which slot machines return more than 100%, where are they located (what casinos), is there a certain denomination that we must play, is there a certain time or other condition under which we must play to be playing at an advantage? No offense to Mr. Dancer, but for any topic, if you mention a certain juicy deal that you’re partaking in, but you don’t share the details so that others (readers) can also partake, it becomes sort of mildly sadistic tantalization. E.g., Imagine telling people that they can get all their car repairs done for free, but not telling them how to get that perk. I say: Bob, ‘fess up and tell us where and how to get to play “advantage slots”, or else don’t even mention them.
since there are not great games to play VP anymore . I also would like to know what kind of slots are for Advantage player and how to find them. i just can’t see how you can gain an advantage in slots.
There are already too many loud, big mouths talking about advantage slots.
At this point, if you don’t know what “advantage slots” are, you’ve missed the boat.
Sabo, there are sites(s) dedicated to up-to-date VP information. Information in a QOD would be stale in days or maybe weeks.
Many people seem to be cagey about advantage play on slots. I doubt they want to disperse information widely and for free (and kill the goose in the process). If you have an interest you will probably have to go looking and the information may not be free I suspect.
There are plenty of basic advantage slots like must hit bys, Scarab, Little Piggies, etc. No different than Ultimate X or UX Gold chasing. I think Google and Instagram can find you some plays. Of course, every month different slot machines come up and it’s real work to figure out how each one of them works and what possible angles there are. I don’t have time for that, since I have a day job, a family, and hobbies I care about. Others may differ. If they only want to share with others who put in the same effort, I don’t blame them.
Actually I’m a hardcore Advantage player. Skill slots were my specialty although they’re pretty much gone now because it really narrowed The Herd of those who could actually beat it. I crushed Texas tea-pin ball and the harder Cleopatria pinball. I also was good at Space Invaders centipede race Ace and many other skill based slots. They sure were good days though while they lasted. I’ve always been an advantage player and will play anything I can beat. I was Advantage playing way before Charles Lund came out with his robbing the one arm Bandits book. So don’t be fooled I know exactly how to play not just one game but literally hundreds. Par sheets and eveeything in between. I merely was pointing out that there’s no useful information in this article. That’s all folks.
Smart and “Strong” players keep their yaps shut.
If I were Ed Thorp, I would NEVER have told the world about card counting.
I disagree with that. If you have knowledge, which could be much more useful in aggregate, why don’t you share it? If it is a small play which would die quickly because of scale, I get it, but I think the democratization of information from folks like Thorp, Wong, Dancer, Shackleford, etc. has been great for everyone. Sharper players who do their research are more inclined to play because they can do so intelligently. People go to a Dancer class, think they can play 100%, and make enough errors to let those who practice more do better.
I feel compelled to make a comment about all the video poker players whining about the good old days of video poker. It kinda reminds me of the Bruce Springsteen song Glory Days. We video poker authors wanted to provide something to the state of the art of profession gambling that you in turn, without any effort on your part, made money off of. Sure, we’ve had some book sales and and our reputation was enhanced, but you guys benefited by our hard work.
Now you feel that there is an obligation to continue to provide you with winning situations. What’s in it for us? Can’t you figure things out for yourselves? I personally have done very well exploiting profitable situations apart from video poker.
That’s crazy. I always assumed LVA writers were at least marginally compensated for their columns. And of course residual from their software and book sales. If you happen to teach video poker classes at a casino there’s another possible Revenue stream. I had no idea everybody was doing it for free!!! I stand corrected. What was I thinking???? My bad.
Cal, I might share it with confederates but not the general public. Case in point, we’ve been hole carding a rare card game for years that even the great JG hasn’t talked about.
Not so sure what’s the big deal about not saying anything about these advantage slot games. The fact is that Slotmachines in the U.S. are not designed in a way it’s done in Europe. So, what I mean by that is that for instance automatic play is not allowed in the U.S. and this is the No 1 problem that advantage slot players have in your country. You simply can’t play on more than 1 machine without getting tired of pushing the start button all the time.
No 2, the tax problem. The 1199 threshold is so extremely low that even most majors on those slots are unplayable under normal conditions and fnding machines with super high majors is difficult if not imposslbe to find.
If you visit Europe you can find similar games with all kinds of jackpots and individual progressive meters and auto-play is possible in many countries. Plus, with a few exceptions, slot-payouts (jackpots) are usually tax free, which is also a big plus.
Only if you are entitled to take off your losses from all taxable handpays it makes sense to play your games, otherwise I consider it as pure entertainment. Tourists for instance are far better off playing high stakes poker rather than advantage slots in Las Vegas.
From Switzerland
Boris
This is the first year that I have played advantage slots, and it has formed the bulk of my current profit. In every previous year, it had been video poker. If you had asked me before New Year’s if I had thought that you could make money off of slot machines, my answer would have been an emphatic NO, because that is what I learned in the mid-’90s. Times are different. The games are different. You have to be just as fluid, in my opinion.
“Unlearn what you have learned.” — Yoda, *The Empire Strikes Back*
And as far as obtaining the knowledge about what advantage slots are and what to look for, there are a number of sources rampant on the internet with plenty of usable, accurate knowledge on the subject, including some websites that a number of players here likely frequent. Bob doesn’t have to come off of what he knows; if you can’t find it, you’re just not looking hard enough. Put in some effort and do some research, just like all of us had to do in the “old days” that everybody seems to be longing for and knows will never return.