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When You Get the Run Around

August 22, 2017 10 Comments Written by Bob Dancer

There was a small drawing at Hooters Casino in Las Vegas on a Friday night ten years ago, but it could have happened anywhere. I read the rules and they stated that you could earn tickets starting at 12:01 Friday morning up until 6 p.m. for the 7 p.m. drawing. It was a too-small-to-be-interesting drawing, but I already had dinner reservations with a friend at the casino. If we’re going to be there anyway, why not enter the drawing?

I arrived at the casino at about 1 a.m. and started playing a $5 machine that was attractive for more reasons than just the drawing. I played until around 3:30 a.m. and figured I had earned approximately 140 tickets, which meant I’d played around $42,000 through the machine. I wasn’t positive of the number, but it had to be pretty close.

I arrived at 5:45 for our 6:00 p.m. dinner date and went to the booth. I was given 25 tickets, implying I’d played $7,500. I knew this was wrong, so I asked to speak to the supervisor. “I AM the supervisor,” I was told.

I explained when I started and how much I’d played and I was assured that the computer system said 25 tickets. “Is your boss on property?” I asked. “Or the Director of Marketing? There is something wrong with the way you are calculating entries and I’d like to get it rectified before the drawing.”

“There’s nothing wrong with the way the system calculates entries,” I was told. She said the Marketing Director was in a meeting but that he’d come and find me in the restaurant if the meeting broke before 7 p.m.

“What about the slot director or the GM?” I asked. “Are either of them on property?” I was trying to be polite with my requests, but I was frustrated and becoming angry. I sincerely believed that I was in the right and I kept being told that I must be confused about when I played. She knew I was Bob Dancer and, hence, probably experienced at this sort of thing, but she was sticking by her position.

It happened that the slot director was walking by. We knew each other and I explained the situation. I asked him if the “official casino day” started at 3 a.m., and if so, perhaps most of my play showed up on the computer on the day before. But there should be a time-stamp on my play, and the rules clearly said you could start at 12:01 a.m.

The slot director confirmed that the casino day started at 3 a.m. and he took the club supervisor into the back room to look at the record. After about five minutes he came out and told me that I was correct and the booth would be giving me more tickets shortly. Somehow the slot club personnel were confused on the difference in “actual day” and “casino day.” In about three minutes, another slot club employee came out and handed me 134 tickets and told me I was mistaken when I asked for 140. That was fine. 140 was an estimate only and 134 was close enough — and certainly better than 25.

It didn’t have to end this way. It was possible that nobody knowledgeable would have shown up and I would have been out of luck. So, what do you do?

For me personally, making a huge scene was out of the question. My personal experience is that upper management tends to take the side of their underlings and if I make a big commotion it’s a convenient excuse to ask me not to play there anymore. Certain other players have no compunctions about loudly sticking up for their rights when they feel they’ve been wronged. But while I wasn’t going to make a big scene, I WAS willing to persistently keep asking to speak to any higher-level employee who would take the time to look at the computer screen.

I could have threatened to “take it to Gaming,” I suppose, but this would end up being way too much effort for way too little gain. I was about to ask to see the computer screen myself figuring that I would be more adept at understanding what was there than the boothlings were. It didn’t go that far and I don’t know if I would have been allowed to do this or not.

Generally speaking, the proper strategy is to not give up when you think you are right. There comes a time when going forward is clearly fruitless, and then you have to decide whether to pursue remedies after the fact. Had I not been able to reach a satisfactory solution before the drawing took place, many casinos would have “taken care of me” after the fact should they finally agree that their boothlings were in error. If I won the drawing anyway there would be no extra compensation, but if I came in second or third, a case could be made that I would probably have done better with an additional 100+ tickets so they might offer me some extra money. They won’t do this, however, unless you are persistent about it.

Players who take a “it’s the principle of the thing and I’ll take it all the way to the Supreme Court!” attitude are being very short-sighted, in my opinion. It’s a long war you’re fighting, not a single battle. I had maybe $200 in EV in this drawing when given the appropriate number of tickets. Losing out on this much EV would be a relatively minor bump in the road. Losing my welcome at this casino (and maybe others because some of these employees will eventually work elsewhere and may well remember if you treated them like dirt way back when) would be much costlier than $200.

Although most promotions have a “management reserves all rights” statement in there, most casinos will try to do the right thing — if they can be persuaded that they were in the wrong.

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10 Comments

  1. Jim Jim
    August 22, 2017    

    How did you fare in the drawing?

  2. Bob Dancer Bob Dancer
    August 22, 2017    

    How did you fare in the drawing?

    ——————————————————————————————–

    No clue. It was a long time ago.

    And also irrelevant to me. I’m far more into EV (which is an average amount over many instances) than whether I collected one particular time or not

  3. Tom Tom
    August 22, 2017    

    Bottom Line: To be mature means you have learned both to pick your battles and then how best to fight them.

    If every injustice or even perceived slight becomes cause for pitched battle, you may frequently experience LOSING Armageddon.

  4. Joe Mama Joe Mama
    August 22, 2017    

    I’ve received many many drawing entries for VP play where VP play was excluded from the accumulation of entries in the fine print of the rules. I guess the message is that casino employees do not always understand all the rules for their promotions.

  5. Mike Mike
    August 22, 2017    

    Bob, perhaps if you didn’t consider them “boothlings” or “underlings” instead of “people” or “folks trying to do their job”, you would have a better result. Frankly, it shows a condescending and demeaning attitude.

    You know, I frequent the Atlantis in Reno and have a great relationship with the personnel at the Paradise Rewards Center. I come in with my whopping $5.00 free play email with the attitude that it’s a big, fun deal to redeem…and guess what, they are thrilled, too! We chat, crack jokes and make the few minutes while they do their thing quite pleasurable. Now maybe I just don’t take video poker as seriously as you do (like a job), but I respect the hard work, long hours on their feet and guff they have to take from players like us. I can’t tell you how many times I got some good inside info on a drawing or the location of an underutilized kiosk to avoid a long line.

    In short, it’s a Honey vs. Vinegar deal. So, the next time you are tempted to call them a “boothling”, understand they might be calling you an “asshole”.

  6. Bob Dancer Bob Dancer
    August 22, 2017    

    That’s a valid point, Mike. And I do treat booth personnel respectfully.

    Perhaps the term ‘boothling’ came across more disparagingly than I intended.

  7. Jimmy Jazz Jimmy Jazz
    August 23, 2017    

    Sure, the people who work at a slot club booth are people but they often times have an inflated view of their job description and knowledge of the casino slot club rules. I have run into numerous slot club workers who didn’t understand the club rules 1/3rd as well as I did but still insisted that they were right and refused to bring in a supervisor. It’s the IRS attitude. You are wrong until you absolutely prove you are right and even then, I might not correct the situation.

    Now, the personnel probably aren’t very well paid and I’ve seen huge turnover at my local casinos so it is tough to get a person who really knows what they are doing. And if they do, they are probably promoted to a different assignment. The main problem isn’t the lack of knowledge, it is the unwillingness to bring in someone more knowledgeable when needed.

  8. Mooski Mooski
    August 23, 2017    

    I had something similar happen to me on a recent trip to Vegas.

    The ‘honey vs vinegar’ approach, combined with the attitude that I’m an idiot and I don’t know what I’m talking about works wonders.

  9. Annie Annie
    August 23, 2017    

    > it’s a Honey vs. Vinegar deal. So, the next time you are tempted to call them a “boothling”, understand they might be calling you an “asshole”.

    This is, imo, unnecessarily harsh.

    Actually, both Bob and Mike were in agreement that a measured, polite response is the way to go in these disagreements. Bob didn’t call them “boothlings” to their faces. There was nothing in the way Bob described his behavior to suggest he was offensive or rude in any way to the casino people. He didn’t call them “boothlings” to their faces. While we can’t know for sure what Bob thinks of service people, if actions speaks louder than words, my guess is that he respects them for the tough jobs they do.

    I’ve had many experiences like Mike’s in restaurants and stores etc. Knowing service people and genuinely liking them and their liking you have many advantages. It makes life much more enjoyable even apart from the practical edge it gives one at the business in getting preferred treatment.

    But I’ve also had many experiences with service people at car rental agencies, airline counters, etc. where the employee deserved even worse than the pejorative job description of “boothling.” One size does not fit all. And one mode of behavior is not always the right one.

  10. James James
    August 27, 2017    

    I don’t think ” condescending and demeaning attitude” fits but “arrogant” might be closer..

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