In last week’s blog, I laid out the nature of my beef with the Rainbow Casino. I was basically fighting over whether I could have someone play off $2,400 in free play — or get a check for $1,200. Whether my case had any merits or not, this was too small to involve a lawyer.
I called up the Gaming Control Board and told them I had a complaint. An agent listened and said that if I wished to go forward with the matter I could come down to the office and fill out the paperwork. I told him I’d be down the next day.
The Nevada GCB here in Las Vegas is located off of Las Vegas Boulevard at Washington, which is in the downtown area, immediately north of Cashman Field. It’s in a building housing a number of other governmental agencies.
The night before I went to the office, I spent considerable time writing out exactly what I wanted and why I felt I was entitled to it. I had been led to believe that whatever I wrote down the next day was basically all I got to say before the decision was rendered. So, I wanted to give it my best shot. I suspect they would have written the report for me if I was not capable of doing so, but I believe I can better present my own argument for myself — given it’s too small to justify hiring an attorney.
I saw the same agent I had spoken to on the phone the day before and he brought me a form to fill out. I told him I thought I would need five or six sheets of paper and he provided them.
After I finished writing up my report, the agent read it. He surprisingly advised me to take the $1,200 and not ask to gamble with the $2,400. He told me it was possible I would end up with less than $1,200 and then I’d feel so bad. I didn’t tell him the game was available for quarters and if you play $2,400 coin-in for quarters on NSU, it’s basically impossible to end up with less than $2,000 — let alone $1,200.
I didn’t think it was in my interest to make it obvious that I was an experienced player. I thanked him for his suggestion and told him I’d prefer to take my chances.
The agent asked if I were an advantage player and then added that it really didn’t matter if I was or wasn’t. I didn’t know if I was on the record or not, so I said I wasn’t a beginner and let the matter drop.
I was then told the GCB would investigate the complaint and issue a ruling within 45 days. If both parties accepted the ruling, that would be it. If either side wished to appeal the ruling, the appeal would be held in a hearing room that was within the same complex of offices.
The ruling came back in about 30 days, basically denying all parts of my claim. The casino was ordered to pay me $1,200 by check within two weeks. While I’m writing this before the two-week period has expired and I haven’t received the check yet, I’m not expecting that to be an issue.
The decision listed several findings it had made, including mentioning that I was no longer allowed on the property. Many of those findings were clearly made after talking to casino employees. Several were different than what I remembered happening. I also recognized that I didn’t record the conversations, and it would be a form of “he said-she said” to figure out what actually happened.
I considered appealing — if only to make this into a three-part blog rather than just a two-parter. After all, whatever happens at the GCB is generally interesting to my readers and the listeners to my podcast.
The bottom line in my decision to not appeal was that I didn’t think I had a case. If you focus on the right part of the slot club rules, it’s clear that I only get 50% if I redeem the points in cash and the casino was within its rights to refuse to let me play the points off. Those rules were “hidden in plain sight,” but they were there, nonetheless.
While I could force the system to chug along and rule absolutely that I wasn’t going to get my way, I believed that eventual ruling was essentially a certainty. The idea of going through the appeal just to have more to talk about in this blog or on the podcast strikes me as more selfish than I like to view myself. I basically am doing nothing, which means I accept the ruling.
Still, I find it useful to have gone through this process. Someday I may well need to go through it again and there are advantages to having gone through it previously.
After I wrote this, I did get the check and deposited it. An agent from the GCB, Kevin Smith, called and asked me to call him back on a personal matter. I did, and he just wanted to verify that I had received the check.
I asked him why he had referred to this as a personal matter. After all, this sounds like ordinary GCB work. He told me that he couldn’t know who would listen to that message, and didn’t wish to be broadcasting that I had just received a check that would be considered large by many people. So he called it a personal matter.
Makes sense. I’m the only one who listens to that voicemail — but he couldn’t know that. I appreciate his extra care.
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A small consolation is that you’ve got the $1200 now and no telling how long it would have taken to get the $2400 free play. So, there’s a little bit of “present value” benefit to you.
Did you get a W2-G with it? My only interaction with GCB was about a slot machine at Harrahs, about 20 years ago, where the glass showed 3 mixed 7’s at $1K, and the machine next to it showed $50. I hit the mixed 7’s on the $1K machine, but only got $50. I called for the slot people and showed them, and they retrieved the programming paperwork for the machine, and said the glass was wrong. I said my expectation was the $1K. They were pretty cool. They said they would call the GCB. Since it was 2 am, they locked down the machine, and a picture was taken on a camera and a copy given to me for proof with the casino night managers signature on it. Next morning at 10am, an agent of the GCB met with me and a different casino manager. After the agent saw the glass and the spin results, the agent immediately told them to pay me the $1K. I got $950 in cash 20 minutes later after the agent filled out some paperwork, which I signed off on. I thought that it would go the other way, as I thought the GCB and casinos washed each other back. I was wrong. A person from IGT was there with a new glass, and 15 minutes later the machine was back up and running correctly. I was pretty happy. I wonder who was responsible for that mistake, and how the glass could be made wrong.
I can’t believe you didn’t appeal. Now you’re going to have to face the humilation of Nersesian calling you a soy boy the next time he’s on your program. Sounds like a classic case of changing horse midstream, the math is straightforward: 90% chance the appeal rules in your favor (assuming you used a simple argument: the freeplay/cash was earned by play, not a marketing giveaway), 10% chance you only get to keep the cash. There’s no downside and lots of upside.
Another point: most non-gamblers think $2400 in casino freeplay is worthless, because everybody knows “the casino always wins”. On the contrary, it is possible to win more than $1200 from $2400 freeplay, however you have to be willing to gamble and you have to have a gambler’s mindset to think that you could possibly win. Notice I said “possibly”. There is always the possibility that in your particular session of $2400 freeplay, you will win a big fat zero. That’s why they call it gambling.
In theory, the free play is worth its value multiplied by the return of the game you use it on. If you use it on a game returning 99%, and cash out as soon as you have played through the awarded amount, then over time, you will retain 99% of your total free play on that game. Of course individual sessions will vary wildly depending on he variance of the game. So Bob’s $2400 in free play was worth substantially more than the $1200 he was being offered.
Experience is the best teacher. Good point that going through this process may be of benefit during a future claim.
Another thought: Given that the casino is going to back you off once you hit a big W2G, which seems likely at all casinos these days, you would prefer to have that W2G be a big one. So, for example, it may be better to play multiplay jacks and go for the dealt royal as your jackpot hand, even though jacks has a slightly lower average return than deuces. Other options might be something like triple double bonus or royal aces or royal deuces which have hands that pay the same as a royal. Basically you want a game with one monster payoff and no smaller mini-payoffs that could trigger the backoff. That’s a problem with deuces which has the deuces mini-jackpot. Make sense? Another option is table games which doesn’t have W2G’s, mostly.
Mr Dancer; your goose was cooked when the agent asked “if I were an advantage player and then added it really didn’t matter if I was or wasn’t”. Of course it mattered – and he knew that you were an AP because who else would fill out six sheets of paper in lieu of the standard one page form? Good try though; I’ve been in a similar situation with a casino on the east coast and was forced to accept 50% of what was rightfully owed to me (and this was settled in court just before we went to trial; the lawyer representing the casino cut a deal with me and I accepted because it took me over a year to get this issue resolved on my own and I couldn’t allocate any more time to the case.)
C’est la vie – the casino is a mighty foe…