Downtown Is Dying

I will agree with you on one point, the light show is dated. That being said downtown has several entertainment options right on Fremont Street as well as the outside vendors. Couple that with the emergence of Fremont East and Zappo’s dumping tons of money into the surrounding area and you have a pretty vibrant area. No it does not have the star quality of Strip resorts but I find that to be part of the charm. I do not want anything to do with ultra-lounges and bottle service.
I would be more likely to use the term "evolving" more than "dying". And most of the evolution is occurring outside the casinos. There are a lot of bars and lounges, especially moving towards the Fremont East district and in the Arts District that cater to a different crowd than the typical downtown crowd.

I have been concerned about the changes that the movement of Zappos, and other folks downtown, and the growth of the Arts/Fremont East district would have on the more established part of downtown; i.e. the casinos.

While I like having the casinos closer together and the whole downtown vibe, the main reason I have always stayed downtown is that it is, for me, a much greater value than the Strip. I don't care about spas, frou-frou restaurants, etc. I like having inexpensive meals and hotels, when I'm paying, and easy comps/decent games when the casino is paying. I worry about whether these places that don't cater to gamblers, but will draw a hipper and maybe less value-conscious crowd downtown, will drive up the prices, whether those "prices" take the form of actual higher prices, stiffer comp requirements, or crappier games.

I think it's going to be interesting to see the continued evolution of downtown.
Downtown is dying? I disagree, at least as it pertains to the casino district.

Well, perhaps you're correct in one sense. The old downtown area, with its vagrants, bums, seedy areas, etc, is dying and going away. Tony Hsieh, regardless of my view on his business view, is reinvigorating the downtown scene. Mark my words....he'll be a major owner of downtown in the next few years. A lot of the businesses that have been around for a while will be gone in a little bit, replaced by hopping bars and entertainment areas. It really took a billionaire to make the massive changes that are needed.

The casinos are reinvesting in their businesses....something that had been lacking in a while. The plastic that you saw covering the tables at LVC? That's due to new construction in the casino. Granted, Tamares Group hasn't been one in the past to really reinvest in their casinos (other than the new stuff in the Plaza), but it's an improvement. There's other possible new projects on the table that I cannot discuss at this point, but they're major reinvestments on FSE.

The new zipline (Slotzilla) will be a major draw to downtown when it's completed in June. It'll blow away the current zipline.

There's new restaurants on Fremont East in just the last few months - a new pizza place,with a full bar and patio in the back, the Commonwealth, The Park, La Comida, the new music venues across from the Cortez (can't remember the names), and the list keeps expanding.

I've seen this rejuvination happen before....when I was quite a bit younger, I saw downtown Denver transform from a seedy warehouse district to an extremely expensive yuppie hangout area and pricey condos. Better? Yes, from what is was before.

I currently work downtown, and when the weather is nice, I walk around there for a bit of exercise. 3-4 years ago, I wouldn't have walked where I do now...now, I walk to 8th or 9th street from Fremont, and down to Charleston and back along anywhere to Main. The old buildings have mostly either been demolished or fenced off...the former "Ice House" on Main has been redone as office buildings, and I see women out walking their dogs by the condo areas. The bums are gone...the area is vacant and waiting for redevelopment. Seriously, it's like watching a real-life game of "Sim-City" playing out.

So, to make a long story short, downtown is not "dying"....it's experiencing a rebirth in my opinion. Give it a couple years, and it'll be a whole new experience.
Oh, one more thing...I find it kind of silly that you complain that Landry's, Tamares, and TLC are now part of downtown, but neglect to mention that MGM and CET own the majority of the Strip.....with much tighter games, according to the Nevada Gaming Comission. Just thought I'd mention it....

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Originally posted by: thegreek<br />Well Oscar put a lot of LV money, time, and effort into the Downtown.

And group, speaking of Oscar, I see now (in the new offer that I got from Plaza) that for anyone planning to visit The Smith Center for the Performing Arts (which is another new Downtown LV spot), people can Wine and Dine at "Oscar's Beef, Booze and Broads" Restaurant before enjoying your show and then get Free Shuttle Service there.

And the Z Bar at Plaza has Happy Hour Monday-Thursday from 5PM-7PM with Live Entertainment Nightly from 7PM-2AM. And so I think that Downtown LV is picking up at least somewhat (and also there's the new Fremont East and the Fremont Eats going on there.

RecVPPlayer
Value is great to a point. But often you do get what you pay for.

I'm very aware that the strip properties are corporate owned and have been for a long time. My point was that Vegas legends Wynn, Binion, Gaughan, Exber have been replaced by corporations too. Maybe these corps will plow money into their properties, maybe not. We'll see what happens at LVC. So far all I've heard is that Amazing Jonathan will be involved in the remodel. I was disappointed in the D when I first went in there. All the hype I had heard, I walk in and..... eh. Fremont East? Underwhelming.

As for the casinos themselves... maybe the Grand will be great and an attraction. The LL property has been closed for several years. The once fun Pioneer has been a tshirt joiint for many years. There haven't been any new casinos since, well I guess Main Street Station.

We'll see what happens. It's been 20 years sinced FSE and a lot of talk and a lot of hype since then. But results are another matter. A new, better zipline will probably be a fun thing to do. Once.

I hope downtown stays afloat, Las Vegas Club can be reborn, Binions can reopen their hotel. I'll continue to make downtown a destinations on my trips. For now.
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Value can be measured in many ways. Downtown Vegas is like an old pair of shoes. Maybe not the greatest looking but comfortable and a good fit. You can have the strip. Once you get past the flash, most of the strip venues offer the same product- this fee and that fee, ever changing pricing guidelines, rip off resort fees, overpriced food, poor service, pathetic comps. To me, downtown has it all over the strip.
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Originally posted by: drmilled
Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Value can be measured in many ways. Downtown Vegas is like an old pair of shoes. Maybe not the greatest looking but comfortable and a good fit. You can have the strip. Once you get past the flash, most of the strip venues offer the same product- this fee and that fee, ever changing pricing guidelines, rip off resort fees, overpriced food, poor service, pathetic comps. To me, downtown has it all over the strip.


Spot on, doc! I am glad we can agree on something. That "old pair of shoes" fits me just fine....
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Originally posted by: prefect
Downtown is dying? I disagree, at least as it pertains to the casino district.

Well, perhaps you're correct in one sense. The old downtown area, with its vagrants, bums, seedy areas, etc, is dying and going away. Tony Hsieh, regardless of my view on his business view, is reinvigorating the downtown scene. Mark my words....he'll be a major owner of downtown in the next few years. A lot of the businesses that have been around for a while will be gone in a little bit, replaced by hopping bars and entertainment areas. It really took a billionaire to make the massive changes that are needed.

The casinos are reinvesting in their businesses....something that had been lacking in a while. The plastic that you saw covering the tables at LVC? That's due to new construction in the casino. Granted, Tamares Group hasn't been one in the past to really reinvest in their casinos (other than the new stuff in the Plaza), but it's an improvement. There's other possible new projects on the table that I cannot discuss at this point, but they're major reinvestments on FSE.

The new zipline (Slotzilla) will be a major draw to downtown when it's completed in June. It'll blow away the current zipline.

There's new restaurants on Fremont East in just the last few months - a new pizza place,with a full bar and patio in the back, the Commonwealth, The Park, La Comida, the new music venues across from the Cortez (can't remember the names), and the list keeps expanding.

I've seen this rejuvination happen before....when I was quite a bit younger, I saw downtown Denver transform from a seedy warehouse district to an extremely expensive yuppie hangout area and pricey condos. Better? Yes, from what is was before.

I currently work downtown, and when the weather is nice, I walk around there for a bit of exercise. 3-4 years ago, I wouldn't have walked where I do now...now, I walk to 8th or 9th street from Fremont, and down to Charleston and back along anywhere to Main. The old buildings have mostly either been demolished or fenced off...the former "Ice House" on Main has been redone as office buildings, and I see women out walking their dogs by the condo areas. The bums are gone...the area is vacant and waiting for redevelopment. Seriously, it's like watching a real-life game of "Sim-City" playing out.

So, to make a long story short, downtown is not "dying"....it's experiencing a rebirth in my opinion. Give it a couple years, and it'll be a whole new experience.


Very well put.I walked by that new pizza place a couple of weeks ago and the pizza looked good,and there seemed to be a positive vibe surrounding the place.Iwas surprised to see the new businesses between the FSE and the El Cortez.
I think the downtown is really going through a revival but retaining its fun atmosphere. I never tire of the lightshows, free entertainment, great inexpensive food and drink. It's always a big part of every trip I make to Las Vegas. My dollar goes a lot farther downtown than on the strip!
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