CIty Center, Disaster Looming??

I don;t want to drive anywhere......I want to WALK I don't like this City Center.

They tried to out upscale the other upscale places that had opened. Didn't get there though. Five years ago on a drawing plan I guess it made sense to the casino brass knuckleheads, when they didn't consider either the debt load or what would happen to all this building all over Vegas in a bad economy. I remember reading 4,500 condos,if we pretend they are all sold, closed and financed ( By which solvent banks, ha!) maybe 6,000 residents? And with all this planning and the 8.5 billion spent where are the amenities for these people to live there? Can they eat canoes? They can drive to that ratty Smiths by the Orleans if they need groceries or an RX filled. Get a gun or knife for the parking lot walk, not the best area. Have fun in your new dream condo!

Spent the evening with a friend of mine who was there about a week ago. He loves the place for one reason: People sitting in the sportsbook with a $5 ticket get all the drinks they want.

Casino Execs Thing they are intelligent, just in the right place at the right time During the 1996-2006 period, times were good, and many people had tons of disposable income to blow. And Vegas had a monopoly. It took talent to NOT make money. There is a limit to how many suckers 1. Want to blow money gambling and/or 2. Want to blow money on $150 nightclubs/$300 dinners Further, I STRONGLY believe that during boom periods many not so savvy financial people get rich (Real Estate, Sales, etc). BUT during the downturn, those with money are the shrewder, harder working, smarter, more conservative types. And these guys don't like to donk off $22 for 1 Pina Colada pre dinner. Ez to forecast now, but really not so hard to forecast in 2007......with so few dumb dumbs left with money to burn, you have to give them a great experience. Bellagio, Wynn STILL get it done. This City Center DOES NOT.

all true but people in good times and in bad will still spend to sin i.e., gambling, drugs, booze n women. maybe not as often as they would from 2000-07 but they still do it. don't write cc off as a complete bust yet. maybe an inauspicious start but it's a marathon not a sprint. i'm certainly glad i didn't buy a condo there but in the long run i'm pretty sure they'll be ok

Couldn't agree with Fezzik more on this one - Lanni, Loveman, etc - all thought to be greatest execs since sliced bread and they weren't - I know the current CFO at one of the bigger corps and he saw this coming 5 years ago - quote "wait til the bubble bursts, it will get ugly" but he made his millions on his options - I've done alot of consulting for the casinos and I can assure you they are not genuises at all. Harrahs/Stations selling out at the peak of market was about the only smart thing I've seen from any of them - and that was more dumb luck than anything as they had private equity firms literally begging them to take tens of millions in personal profit and they had to take it. Like Fezzik said, they couldn't help but make money with all the idiots with money rolling into town, or locals feeling rich to their home values doubling in 3 years. Now they have to actually out think, market and perform the other guy. Here's an idea - quit screwing the customer so much -how about some 9/6 DDB VP vs 7/5, how about some old fashioned SD 3/2 BJ (I think we can train Pit Bosses on how to counter CC's) vs. that 6/5 crap they have now, how firing the grumpy craps dealer, etc. Give people a fair shot for their money. I'm only sorry because of the effect it's had on the town - but at least these guys have been exposed (as most CEO's were) - it's easy to just layoff people in a downturn, it's harder to actually think about how to use a recession to your advantage to gain market share - most of these guys don't get it - agree Wynn is the sharpest.

Wynn wont comp you a drink if you are firing away at $1 video poker for 5 coins a hand at a bar. He is more the designer of the problem than someone who gets it right

Wynn Scrooged his dealers out of tips and his sportsbook is a well known sewer. On New Years Eve, I tried to bet 3,000 on a side, I am not known there and had a beer, I was told $500 max, literally the guy next to me bet $30,000 on a side, with his host next to him. Side I would have bet 3k on lost anyway. They will only take a bet from people they are sure are idiots.

Black, agree on Wynn and not comping VP players at the bar - seems very stupid to me. Sports betting - I've said it many times before - the sports books don't even register on the casino's financial statements in terms of materiality - the sports books are there for one reason - to attract and keep gamblers, especially the high rollers, in the casino - they don't want them going across the street to bet/watch a game and then eat, shop, play craps, bj, slots somewhere else. So your experience there doesn't surprise me a bit. Like BJ, they know sports betting is a beatable game and they will keep their risk as low as possible - they'll let the whale bet that amount because they know it's not sharp action and even if it wins, they likely get it back tenfold at the tables. And I don't think Wynn is any genuis, just think he's better than the rest of the lot.

[QUOTE=Fezzik;14147] Further, I STRONGLY believe that during boom periods many not so savvy financial people get rich (Real Estate, Sales, etc). BUT during the downturn, those with money are the shrewder, harder working, smarter, more conservative types.[/quote] I agree with this. It's easy to make lots of money in a bull market, and it's easy to claim you're a genius when your stock goes up 22% in a market that goes up 20%. It's even easier to do this when you're leveraged to the hilt. [quote] Ez to forecast now, but really not so hard to forecast in 2007......[/QUOTE] So, where were you in 2007? NOBODY was saying this in 2007. Moreover, every analyst following these stocks was demanding massive leverage and rapid expansion. Sure, you can fairly blame the casino execs for following the herd, but everyone was doing the same thing. The only difference between MGM's execs and everyone else's is that they had a bigger credit line and when the crash came they were too far along to abort the project the way Boyd did. It's awfully easy to say, "you should've known". Show me that you were on top of it then, and I'll be impressed.