Another day, another ICE killing

Probably my favorite Bible story. 

I am by no means an expert but to my knowledge that was pretty much the only time Jesus used violence in the Bible. 

I think there are times he informed others to prepare for a time of conflict where people will be violent against them, but I'm not sure if he encouraged violent resistance.

 I think I remember that when he was arrested he discouraged his disciples from using violence to intervene in the arrest. But I could be misremembering. It's been quite some time since I've read it. 

And I would hope that someone else would be filming as they lunged toward me and knocked my phone out of my hand--as ICE agents have done several times to people recording their actions.

It is indeed a safety in numbers thing. Alone, I would be worried about the thugs arresting or even shooting me. With twenty witnesses, all also recording? Not so much.

But if I were alone, I'd still take the risk. I consider it my obligation. God knows, if I was being unlawfully assaulted by the police, I'd want at least one person to witness it AND to bear witness. And if I was shot and killed...even more so.

I'm not sure I totally agree with her analysis. She seems to imply that he was reaching for his firearm but the firearm had already been taken from him. Maybe I misunderstand her analysis. 

From the video I'm not able to conclude whether he put his hand behind his back because he was reaching towards the holster or because he was about to be handcuffed. 

I'd like to see a full size full resolution version of that video. 

One thing I speculate may have happened is the officer who disarmed him had a negligent discharge causing other officers to panic fire. 

Kevin, The Bible probably is the most cherry-picked of documents ever.  So to speak. 

Jesus did have his tantrums, it is said.  I'll check into your question, tho I am no biblical scholar.  You've had way more 'Sunday School' than I.

To this day scholars of theology disagree who did what, where, when did they do it.  OT names, who married whom, who begat whom, did people really live to be hundreds of years old?   How could they tolerate the odor inside of that ark, all those people and animals?  Funny that isn't mentioned, though maybe in other translations?

The four Gospels tell pretty much the same story of Jesus' birth, death and resurrection, but with differences in the accounting.  Written 'accounts' were scarce.  Eyewitness accounts, same issues as today.  Translations?  Heck, isn't our Bible translated from Greek first? 

My husband was raised in Catholic schools.  They totally missed his lazy eye and ADD in elementary school,  couldn't read the board, etc.  They held him back a year for which he was mercilessly taunted by classmates, siblings (emotionally devastating, he said).  He overcame a lot afterward, fortunately.  But I digress.

I'll check into your question, tho I am no biblical scholar.   You've had way more 'Sunday school' than I've ever had.   

Is the military obligated or excused for their acts of killing?  Yes, of course, by our laws, which also provide for the consciencious objector.  

Yes, I try to follow Jesus, but like all of us I fall short.  Seems like a good idea, though, to do the best I can.  Plus, church, SS, Bible study, pot lucks, feel more like ongoing education at my leisure, I don't have to get up and get dressed for if I don't want to.  LOL.

Candy

It did seem that they were annoyed more by anyone recording them, assisting a person being knocked down and all the above.  It's a risk to say the least.  Not one I'd probably take.  

Well, give an untrained thug a gun, insert him into a situation where he's quite likely to be annoyed, and...

The thing is, we used to have recourse when crazy, violent people with guns invaded our communities. But not now, with the crazies being government employees acting under direct orders of the chief executive. Trump orgasmed over and over when Renee and Kyle were killed.

So we should be able to stop all this shit by standing aside and letting the law take care of it. But the law in America is dying 

This is how the sane people act -  

You are correct that Jesus instructed his followers from using violence at his arrest.  And Jesus knew what was going to happen to him.  

"Do justly, love mercy, and walk humbly with thy God."  Micah 6: 8

Micah was a prophet distressed by abusive treatment of the poor by the rich and influential, any who would use their social or political power for personal gain.  The question in 6:7 is "What does the Lord require of me?  

Do justice.  Seek fairness, defend the oppressed

Love mercy.  Be compassionate, show kindness, forgive others, serve others

Walk humbly.  Maintain closeness with God, walking in his footsteps.  Be humble, be thankful and not complaining.

Read Romans 12, the Apostle Paul's letter about our bodies being "living sacrifices" and the abilities God gave us.

"If God has given you the ability to prophesy, then prophesy whenever you can.  If your gift is that of serving others, serve them well.  If you are a teacher, do a good job of teaching.  If you are a preacher, see to it that your sermons are strong and helpful.  If God has given you money, be generous in helping others with it.  If god has given you adminstrative ability and put you in charge of the work of others, take the responsibility seriously.  Those who offer comfort to the sorrowing should do so with Christian cheer."

                                                                                             Romans12:6-8 The Living Bible Paraphrased.

And it goes on.  The whole of Chapter 12, instruction how we should live.  In fact Chapter 12 through the rest of  Romans. 

In fact, the entire book of Romans! Said to be Paul's greatest work, condenses the most systematic presentation of doctrine in the Bible.

Hey, ask me the time and I build you a clock...LOL.  Sorry to go on and on.

Candy

Well, Jesus's death was pretty much an elaborate suicide, and his plea to God just before he was arrested to...what was it .."take this cup from me" indicates that he knew what was going to happen and was prepared to not resist or try to escape--but he sure as Cleveland didn't like it. He had been instructed to take one for the team. He could have negotiated his freedom easily enough. Pontius Pilate didn't think he was guilty of sedition and realized what was going on--the Hebrew elders wanted his ass gone. So in order to keep the peace, he fed Jesus to them.

So the reason why I'm going on about this is: are we, too, obligated to sacrifice ourselves for justice/the greater good, should the necessity arise? Or the opportunity?

Micah's advice is good, though I was walking humbly across the street the other day and a driver honked at me and yelled, "MOVE IT, ASSHOLE!"

Which verse in Romans tells us that we should never put ketchup on a hot dog? It wasnt on Moses' tablets because he ran out of room.

Jesus condensed the Jew's 600+ laws covering every aspect of every day life (something like that, a lot anyway) laws, which did include dietary restrictions, into 10 so that believers could follow them.  

Nobody promised anybody a rose garden for following Jesus' teachings.  

You skipped what I wrote about "sacrifice" from the book of Romans:  We are to be "living sacrifices" meaning we strive to follow Jesus' teachings even though some may go against our sinful natures or what we want to do instead of what we should do.  Not an obligation to act despite certain harm, though many in the Bible did so in their allegiance to God and Jesus.  Daniel in the OT for one.  The 11 disciples (12 minus Judas Iscariot who betrayed Jesus then killed himself) all went out to proclaim about Jesus; all except John (the Apostle) suffered torturous deaths for their martyrdom.  John died of old age, likely in prison.

Kevin, I have never in my 78+ years heard anyone, pastor, professor, Bible study leader, Christian, Jew, agnostic or atheist refer to Jesus' death as "an elaborate suicide." 

What makes you say that?  Did the nuns teach it?  Surely not.

Yes, Jesus knew he would be slain.  Crucifixion was the method of capital punishment at the time; everybody knew it including Jesus.  Jesus asked God to "let this cup pass" because at that point he WAS human and knew it would be a painful event.  But he quickly said 'not my will but yours' to God.  Non-believers such as yourself taunted Jesus to pull off some magic and make it all go away.  God had to work it through crucifixion, death and resurrection, for the world to accept that Jesus was the Messiah.  Nobody else in history has beaten death and risen again.

Candy