Bigly jobs! Bigly stock market! Woo hoo!

We learned over the last few years, by the grace of sages such as Mother Tucker, Sean "Ham"mity, Stalker, Boiler, Bozo the Clown, etc. that jobs growth and a booming stock market are incontrovertible signs of the ineffable wisdom and manly leadership skills of the man who is President when all that happens.

 

I have absorbed their mighty teachings and therefore must conclude that with over half a million jobs created in the last month alone and the stock market setting record highs every day, President Biden is a bigly economic genius, biglier than even (dare I say it?) Donald Trump!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

(Because we know that the President, whoever he may be, is the sole determinant of what's happening in the world economy, and therefore when it's going great, we all must praise our Dear Leader. How do we know? Mother Tucker told us so!)

I frequent LVA and the forums to keep up to date with all the activity in Vegas.  I also review this forum to see what has been recently posted.  I've been viewing all the banter the last few months and have been silent.  If anything, this feels like a microcosm of America - my gosh do we have issues.

 

Kevin.  What is the deal?  Why the constant vitriol and need to get the last word on any post on this site?

 

I'm not certain I understand why we need all of this political crap on here?  Can we all agree that things right now are jacked up?  The country is a mess.  It has been for quite some time.  Right now it seems like we are more separated than ever before, which I find to be a shame.  I honestly feel like we all need to come together with solutions for the entire country.  None of this left-right stuff.

 

I'll be up front.  Did I like Trump?  Policies - yes.  Twitter feed and non-stop bragging?  No.  Do I like Biden?  His former moderate self with him stating he would bring our country together?  Yes.  What we have going on right now with wierd spending bills, Afghanistan, the border crisis, reparations for separated illegals at the border with crazy amounts of money?  No.

 

Happy to engage in friendly conversation regarding the issues and removing all the insults.  We can do better.  

I guess you truly don't understand the good that Biden is trying to do, since you call it "weird" and "crazy." I guess you truly don't understand the evil that Republicans are trying to do, with the sole goal of seizing and keeping power, permanently. They want to never lose another election again--regardless of how those silly ol' votes actually go.

 

We have one political party that wants to help people and solve social problems, and another that listens to conspiracy theories, ignores science, even when doing so kills people, and is utterly ruthless. There's no compatibility, actual or potential. The things that one side considers essential (voting rights; income equality; environmental stewardship; racial justice), the other side considers abhorrent. Just consider, for instance, the wildly controversial statement, "Black people should be allowed to vote" and how each party reacts to it.

 

One of the major ideological gulfs between the two sides is that one thinks that making rich people and big corporations as wealthy and powerful as possible is a noble social goal, while the other thinks that the excessive power wielded by the rich is the cause of most of our social problems. Is there any way to reconcile those opposing points of view? I don't see how.

 

We liberals view conservatives as unscrupulous, unethical, and often, downright batshit crazy. I'm sure that conservatives have similar views about us. Is there common ground when two groups loathe each other? Perhaps. But every time liberals try to create some kind of rapproachement, conservatives spit in their face.

 

If you want an illustration...just read David Miller's tiresome rant that will surely follow this post. Would any sane person even try to get along with him and his kind? It would be futile.

I can't tell whether Kevin is mocking or praising the state of the Stock Market right now.  I'm a financial dunce so do not claim to have anything wise to say.  

 

All I know is when the Stock Market plummeted in the fashion of 2008, my retirement fund plummeted.  I hung on way too long before I moved the remains to a safe, i.e. little return, fund.  I missed the 'bounce' when I got back in to higher return funds.  I lost a lot in that time.

 

I'm happy when the Market goes up nicely, since that usually makes my retirement fund improve.  I ashamedly depend on my investment firm to move things around to my benefit.  When the Market (and my investments) did nicely during the Trump administration, I was glad.  Right now (Biden adminstration) it is doing nicely, so again that makes me glad.  Two different POTUSs (boy are they different!). 

 

Market corrections occur in every administration, some hurt, some help.  That's all I know.

 

Candy  


The foolishness is in attributing a stock market advance or decline to the current President. So yes, I was mocking Trump's and his lackeys' crowing about the stock market doing so well early in his administration--and then being zip-lipped about the subject when the market completely tanked in 2020. Our resident Trumpers were bleating loud and long about the financial godhood of their orange hero.

 

The hypocrisy, of course, is in giving Trump bigly credit for the market going up but not giving Biden credit for the same thing. The truth is that neither deserves credit or blame for how the stock market is/was doing.

 

The RepubliQ conservitards gave Trump bigly credit for everything that went right during his administration but assigned zero blame to him for everything that went wrong. So I guess there's an evil consistency in their current stance of blaming Biden for everything that's going wrong but giving him zero credit for everything that's going right.

 

As far as your investments are concerned...you have an investment firm handling things for you, and I'm sure that one of the things they'd tell you is to not be too concerned when the market moves up or down, even (as has happened multiple times recently) dramatically. Over the long term, you'll still make money. It's gotten a LOT more volatile in these days of computerized trading, institutional buyers and sellers, and often bizarre and irrational speculation, but it's still +EV.

Originally posted by: Seymour Butts

I frequent LVA and the forums to keep up to date with all the activity in Vegas.  I also review this forum to see what has been recently posted.  I've been viewing all the banter the last few months and have been silent.  If anything, this feels like a microcosm of America - my gosh do we have issues.

 

Kevin.  What is the deal?  Why the constant vitriol and need to get the last word on any post on this site?

 

I'm not certain I understand why we need all of this political crap on here?  Can we all agree that things right now are jacked up?  The country is a mess.  It has been for quite some time.  Right now it seems like we are more separated than ever before, which I find to be a shame.  I honestly feel like we all need to come together with solutions for the entire country.  None of this left-right stuff.

 

I'll be up front.  Did I like Trump?  Policies - yes.  Twitter feed and non-stop bragging?  No.  Do I like Biden?  His former moderate self with him stating he would bring our country together?  Yes.  What we have going on right now with wierd spending bills, Afghanistan, the border crisis, reparations for separated illegals at the border with crazy amounts of money?  No.

 

Happy to engage in friendly conversation regarding the issues and removing all the insults.  We can do better.  


Dear Seymour,

 

How about I ask you a friendly question?

 

Since Trump had the worst GDP growth of the last seven presidents - even before the pandemic - signed the surrender terms with the Taliban, separated children from their parents while they were LEGALLY ( 8 U.S.C. § 1157) attempting to gain asylum, raised the deficit by $2 trillion, and promised that Covid would just "disappear," what specific policies did you like.

 

I look forward to your friendly, unevasive answer.

 

Best regards,

 

MP

Well, any answer to that question has to presume that Trump actually had any "policies" as we define the term. Hell, he didn't even have a platform in 2020. Instead, his policies were "make shit up as I go along," "me me me me me," and "get my ass reelected by any means necessary."

 

He did, of course, exhibit spasms of behavior such as engaging in dick-swinging contests with North Korea and Iran and breaking numerous treaties, but all those moves were spur-of-the-moment (and pulled out of his ass), to the extent that even he didn't know he was going to do them until one morning he just woke up and said, "Hey, I have an idea!" And more often than not, that idea was implanted in his brain by Fox News.

 

So maybe his policies were "whatever I dream up" and "what Fox News tells me to do." Definitely admirable!

Edited on Nov 8, 2021 4:24pm

MisterPicture,

 

1.  GDP.  Seems to me GDP was doing just fine during his administration until the pandemic hit (2.3, 3, 2.2, -3.5).  Numbers in line with the previous administration minus the pandemic year (1.8, 2.5, 3.1, 1.7).  Clinton's numbers were way better.

 

2.  Taliban?  Afghanistan.  Yep - the previous administration engaged the Taliban to withdraw.  The current administration withdrew.  Poorly.

 

3.  Separated children from parents.  Multiple administrations involved and a gigantic mess that congress has failed to address for years and years.  Border should be enforced.  Media amplified this with photos of cages that apparently had been used during a previous administration.  This issue of 450k per episode of separation appears to be excessive and even caught our president off guard with him calling that 'garbage'.  The question is - were these children and adults entering the country illegally?  

 

4.  Deficit - CARES act.  Pandemic related.  Nevertheless, more spending.

 

5.  Covid.  The development of the vax in warp speed was amazing.  His messaging was awful.  Also - the vax became politicized which created a very confused population resulting in resistance. 

 

What policies did I like?  Unemployment rates were low.  Market was doing great.  Deregulation.  Chinese Tariffs.  Energy Independence.  Support for Israel.  Withdrawal from the Paris Climate Accord and the Iran Nuke Deal.  Border policy.

 

Inflation is bad.  Period.  The rate on a US Savings bond type I is over 7%.  Wages can't keep up with the cost of goods and there are too many dollars floating around.  Gas prices are out of control.  Do we really need this BBB legislation right now?  Can we please address the issue at our Southern border?  

 

I've personally had it with congress.  They get nothing done and grandstand.  There should be term limits implemented so that these clowns can't make a career out of this.  The longer they stay the less connected they become to reality.

 

As to the market - what is there to complain about?  If you are in equities it's been a great run!  I don't think presidential administrations have that much to do with it even though when the numbers are great they brag about it and when they are in the tank they get ignored.

 

Sincerely,

 

SB

1. It's idiotic for anyone to claim that GDP growth, or lack thereof, can be attributed to whose butt is in the White House, but that didn't stop Trump from bragging about the economy nonstop until it tanked.

2. You can't criticize Biden for handling the Afghanistan withdrawal "poorly" unless you have some genius plan of your own (which nobody else thought of) that would have worked better (and was a practical possibility).

3. Were these families entering the country illegally? Fuck, no. They presented themselves at the border (which isn't entering the country--it's requesting entry) and legally asked for asylum.

4. The deficit has two causes. Republican talking heads focus on only one cause--spending (because it's in their basic playbook to portray Democrats as reckless spenders). However, lack of revenue is an equal cause. And the Trump tax giveaways for the rich created a deficit that is larger than all of the spending the Democrats are posing combined (over the same 10-year time period). So if the Trump tax cuts were rescinded, all those bills would be paid for.

5. Who do you think is responsible for vaccinations being politicized? (Hint: not Democrats. In fact, Biden has cost himself considerable political capital by his insistence that federal and large-company workers be vaccinated.)

 

Many of the things you like were actually pretty bad. Deregulation allowed many industry players to resume polluting and relax environmental standards (how much you care about that might depend on how aware you are of the danger). The tariffs on China did nothing other than jack up prices for consumers (which is why tariffs have always been a terrible idea, something that anyone with even a passing knowledge of American history and economics would know). "Energy independence" is a stupid concept, in that we are capable of generating enough energy on our own to meet our needs (so we've always been energy independent) but we don't, because it's cheaper to import at least some of it. Support for Israel is dubious, considering how they treat the Palestinians. Withdrawal from the Paris and Iran treaties was monumentally stupid and aside from the immediate consequences, sent the message that we don't honor our agreements, which lowers our standing in the world. And if you actually liked Trump's stupid and cruel "border policy" (including Da Wall), well, then, there's no hope for you.

 

About inflation. Yeah, people don't like it. But if you want to look at it a little less shallowly than most people, there's one thing you should know: prices are still well below what they would have been had the pandemic not hit and inflation had continued at the January 2020 rate. In other words, the economy is just "catching up."

 

The same can be said for gas prices. Adjusted for inflation, gas is still cheaper than it was during at least four 3+ month-long periods since 2000. Hell, it's cheaper even in absolute terms than it was during several stretches (I remember paying $4.79 early in 2016).

 

Roughly half of the US Savings Bond yield is an inflation adjustment. So, in real terms, interest on a 7% nominal return bond is actually about 3.5%.

 

There is no "issue" or "crisis" at our southern border. There have been some temporary problems. But what no one seems to realize amid all the Fox News ranting and raving is that tens of thousands of trucks cross the border every day. People still present themselves and apply for asylum or temporary residence. Nothing has changed in those aspects.

 

If you don't like what Congress is doing, well, their terms only last two years. And whoever you might be, you can only have a tiny influence on who is the occupant of ONE Congressional seat. So it's not really under your control. I personally think that all the insurrectionist House members who voted to not certify the election should be expelled and forbidden to ever hold public office again. But I realize that the 75 million brain-dead assholes who infest this country will vote them back in not only despite their treason, but because of it.

 

And one other thing--you wish to separate Trump's "policies" from the man's behavior. That can't be fairly done. The man is a boor and an ass--and Jesus, what an ignorant piece of garbage. He literally made it all up as he went along. Throughout history, there have been incompetent leaders. But some of them have known enough to surround themselves with competent advisors. Trump surrounded himself with sycophants, many of whom knew not bloody all about the critical jobs they were tasked to do.

Edited on Nov 10, 2021 11:26am

We can agree to disagree on a myriad of topics.  Nothing wrong with that, right?  I don't understand the need to use profanity and stereotype large segments of the population.  It doesn't benefit anyone.

 

Afghanistan?  That plan was awful.  The execution was abysmal.  I don't care what side of the aisle you are on.

 

Energy Independence?  What is wrong with producing what we need here and not rely on some of these other countries that wish to do us harm?

 

Claiming asylum is fine.  What percentage of those people actually have it granted?  How many are released into the general population and do not show for their court proceedings?  Congress needs to address this.  The system is broken.

 

Don't make excuses for fuel prices.  I don't care if it is cheaper based on adjusted whatever.  The increase is significant and impacts everyone who has a gas powered vehicle.

 

If you wonder why Trump won - take a look at who he ran against.  I'd venture to guess more votes were against somebody rather than for someone.  Seems to be a recurring theme in our Presidential races.

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