We voted today and the lines were long. Nobody in our area has seen turnout like this. I am told it has been very busy all week. it took about 20 minutes including showing ID and signing for a ballot and waiting for a machine. Lots of possitive talk about the pride of showing ID to vote . Not very much money being spent in our state, but the ads in LAS Vegas have been brutal.
Originally posted by: Brent Kline
We voted today and the lines were long. Nobody in our area has seen turnout like this. I am told it has been very busy all week. it took about 20 minutes including showing ID and signing for a ballot and waiting for a machine. Lots of possitive talk about the pride of showing ID to vote . Not very much money being spent in our state, but the ads in LAS Vegas have been brutal.
Well, if history is any indication, the more people vote, the better it is for Democrats...but then, Colorado will go blue no matter what. Any interesting downballot contests in CO?
@ Kevin...A secure border involves a structured / orderly prevention of illicit movement of weapons, drugs, contraband and people at said border. That structure lends itself to a goal and sense of national / local security and US sovereignty. A secure border further promotes lawful entry and exit for properly vetted / processed migrants. Further, a secure border provides for more orderly and lawful trade interactions at ports of entry. Not many of those conditions are occurring right now. Spoken like a good conservative, right?
No not all immigrants are criminals; in fact the actual proportion of criminals among the migrant population is probably less than that similar nefarious proportion for the US Congress ( that may not be a joke..who knows).. But we need to know which migrants are indeed criminals because we know it's occurring; some of them are indeed nutjobs that we don't have need for..and some are indeed dangerous and we have evidence for that. Most aren't but we have to have a system in place to distill / filter / and ID all entering the country. I mean, Disneyland and Vegas casinos do a better job of vetting people than we do at our border currently.
Most of these migrants are attempting to better their life situations and I have no qualms with those people or their intent. Yet we have to have an orderly/ legal / fair processing system to maintain US sovereignty and security; such a system protects migrants as well as US citizens. The costs of the current border situation is another large debacle that's in force; we don't have any idea what it all costs as we pay the tax bill. It's a damned shame that the current system has been broken for so long; delayed asylum decisions, inadequate asylum housing, countless additional inadequacies not the least of which is a quarreling bunch of squirrels in DC ( both / all parties are guilty). It's hard to figure out the largest economic benefactor/s of the porous border ( beyond the drug trade)..that's probably both sides as well in various opaque forms. Money talks and the rest walks...again.
Originally posted by: Nines
@ Kevin...A secure border involves a structured / orderly prevention of illicit movement of weapons, drugs, contraband and people at said border. That structure lends itself to a goal and sense of national / local security and US sovereignty. A secure border further promotes lawful entry and exit for properly vetted / processed migrants. Further, a secure border provides for more orderly and lawful trade interactions at ports of entry. Not many of those conditions are occurring right now. Spoken like a good conservative, right?
No not all immigrants are criminals; in fact the actual proportion of criminals among the migrant population is probably less than that similar nefarious proportion for the US Congress ( that may not be a joke..who knows).. But we need to know which migrants are indeed criminals because we know it's occurring; some of them are indeed nutjobs that we don't have need for..and some are indeed dangerous and we have evidence for that. Most aren't but we have to have a system in place to distill / filter / and ID all entering the country. I mean, Disneyland and Vegas casinos do a better job of vetting people than we do at our border currently.
Most of these migrants are attempting to better their life situations and I have no qualms with those people or their intent. Yet we have to have an orderly/ legal / fair processing system to maintain US sovereignty and security; such a system protects migrants as well as US citizens. The costs of the current border situation is another large debacle that's in force; we don't have any idea what it all costs as we pay the tax bill. It's a damned shame that the current system has been broken for so long; delayed asylum decisions, inadequate asylum housing, countless additional inadequacies not the least of which is a quarreling bunch of squirrels in DC ( both / all parties are guilty). It's hard to figure out the largest economic benefactor/s of the porous border ( beyond the drug trade)..that's probably both sides as well in various opaque forms. Money talks and the rest walks...again.
Here is the CBO report on the effects of the immigration surge on the federal budget and the economy. Check the section on budgetary effects. It states that "The increase in immigration boosts federal revenues as well as mandatory spending and interest on the debt in CBO’s baseline projections, lowering deficits, on net, by $0.9 trillion over the 2024–2034 period (see Table 1)." Here is a link to the report. https://www.cbo.gov/publication/60569
Originally posted by: Jerry Ice 33
What are you guys thinking will happen with this election? I'm curious. I am trying to not follow it very much as I just have about zero tolerance for politics of any kind these days.
I think it's a tossup and will be a close election, unfortunately on the national level I'm forced to vote straight Dem to offset the possibility that Trump will win. On the state level I have a couple of RINOs to vote for.
Originally posted by: Nines
The immigration / border situation is absolutely not about race hatred nor replacement theory for most US citizens. Roughly 80% ( pick your own sordid polling source stats) see it as a real problem that requires immediate attention. We can't afford a structureless border policy that ignores traditional immigration laws and compromized vetting of potential criminals. These facts and voter sentiment have caused a recent shift in vocalized border policy stances by the Democrats as the election approaches. Now many are claiming " we have to secure the border" in campaign speeches now , in many cases because it's politically expedient. In several ways, the new D approach is blatantly hypocritical vs the last few years. Despite that, I'm ecstatic that the D's are finally verbalizing that the border is a problem
The recently tabled / canned so called bipartisan immigration reform bill that Trump and the main R body allegedly sabotaged would have accomplished very little regarding limitations on actual border crossings. It's
plain that Trump didn't want this legislation to go forward for his own political reasons; otoh there are several tenets in the bill that are pretty shallow imo. Just note that 4 R senators plus 5 D senators plus Bernie Sanders voted no on the bill, which required 60 yes votes to move on to the House (in the end it failed 50-49 in the Senate vote). Obviously, the bill would have never passed the House had it made it there. There were some positive elements to the bill, but it also would not have limited daily crossings of up to 5000 migrants on a weekly average basis. The bill and ensuing law would not have secured the border despite some peripheral positive moves ( more border agents, enhanced technologies, supposedly expedited asylum processes, et al).
The cynical political game carries on.
I won't go into great detail on this, I've done it previously and never had a response from the conservative or MAGA posters. The Republicans have had several opportunities to help craft a comprehensive border solution and have passed on it every time. From the Gang of 8 bipartisan immigration bill that passed in the Senate in 2013, John Boehner never brought it to the House floor, to the first two years of the Trump administration. Republicans like to talk about it but never do anything about it, they want to campaign on it.
Every bi-partisan bill is never good enough for them even to debate on the floor.
Your thoughts on HB 2 - Secure the Border Act of 2023?
Originally posted by: Kevin Lewis
Well, if history is any indication, the more people vote, the better it is for Democrats...but then, Colorado will go blue no matter what. Any interesting downballot contests in CO?
Hi Kevin. The most interesting contest is CO3 with Adam Frisch (D) making a 2nd attempt to win the seat after losing to Lauren Boebert in 2022 by 546 votes. He is running against Jeff Hurd (R). The other one is CO8 where incumbent Yadira Caraveo (D) is running against state representation Gabe Evans (R). In 2022, Carveo won by 1,600 votes. The 12 member CO independent Congressional redistricting commission draws the Congressional district. It is comprised of 4 Republicans, 4 Democrates, and 4 Independents. They send their recommendation to the Supreme Court for final approval. It isn't created by partisan state legislators. That's why the CO delegation is bipartisan because there are some very competitive races. Take care.
Originally posted by: MaxFlavor
I won't go into great detail on this, I've done it previously and never had a response from the conservative or MAGA posters. The Republicans have had several opportunities to help craft a comprehensive border solution and have passed on it every time. From the Gang of 8 bipartisan immigration bill that passed in the Senate in 2013, John Boehner never brought it to the House floor, to the first two years of the Trump administration. Republicans like to talk about it but never do anything about it, they want to campaign on it.
Every bi-partisan bill is never good enough for them even to debate on the floor.
Your thoughts on HB 2 - Secure the Border Act of 2023?
Both major parties have botched immigration reform for a long time. I liked many aspects of HB2 that passed the house but died there; I think your average conservative would approve of that bill. It tightened up the asylum process and in the long run curtailed some fiscal aspects that imo are wasteful. Had it passed the Senate , Biden would have likely vetoed it anyway. The party power people on both sides need to engender / encourage compromise on immigration..it's a hard row to hoe, obviously. Post-election, maybe.
Originally posted by: Robert Davis
Here is the CBO report on the effects of the immigration surge on the federal budget and the economy. Check the section on budgetary effects. It states that "The increase in immigration boosts federal revenues as well as mandatory spending and interest on the debt in CBO’s baseline projections, lowering deficits, on net, by $0.9 trillion over the 2024–2034 period (see Table 1)." Here is a link to the report. https://www.cbo.gov/publication/60569
That looks like a partial cost accounting from the CBO; they admittedly excluded discretionary spending increases to accommodate the migrant surge. I don't know what those costs actually amount to, but they're not insignificant. The surge would also increase mandatory spending ( including SSI , Medicare, housing, more) as your quoted statement above indicates.
Originally posted by: Nines
Both major parties have botched immigration reform for a long time. I liked many aspects of HB2 that passed the house but died there; I think your average conservative would approve of that bill. It tightened up the asylum process and in the long run curtailed some fiscal aspects that imo are wasteful. Had it passed the Senate , Biden would have likely vetoed it anyway. The party power people on both sides need to engender / encourage compromise on immigration..it's a hard row to hoe, obviously. Post-election, maybe.
The biggest problem with HB2, in my opinion, is it's completely partisan, sponsored, and passed by only Republicans, not a single Democrat supported it. That tells me, very clearly, that the current House Republicans have no interest in passing significant border security reforms.
As a result of years of inaction by the Republicans on an issue they roll out every 2-year election cycle to loudly protest, I've lost any interest in listening to them whine about it.
