The Problem With Democrats

Originally posted by: jatki99

Childhood memory. I still sing some of the tunes when remembering...the preamble being one of 'em

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yHp7sMqPL0g


That song was exactly what I thought of when he said Healthcare wasn't in the Constitution.

 I must have missed the specific reference to "healthcare"in the Constitution. Can Mark point to the specific reference?

You missed it because you wish not to see it.  According to Alexander Hamilton, General Welfare includes healthcare or any other program that provides for the well-being of the general population. His view was adopted by the Supreme Court in United States v. Butler in 1936.

 

 

 

Since the foundation of the Nation, sharp differences of opinion have persisted as to the true interpretation of the phrase. Madison asserted it amounted to no more than a reference to the other powers enumerated in the subsequent clauses of the same section; that, as the United States is a government of limited and enumerated powers, the grant of power to tax and spend for the general national welfare must be confined to the enumerated legislative fields committed to the Congress. In this view, the phrase is mere tautology, for taxation and appropriation are, or may be, necessary incidents of the exercise of any of the enumerated legislative powers. Hamilton, on the other hand, maintained the clause confers a power separate and distinct from those later enumerated, is not restricted in meaning by the grant of them, and Congress consequently has a substantive power to tax and to appropriate, [p66] limited only by the requirement that it shall be exercised to provide for the general welfare of the United States. Each contention has had the support of those whose views are entitled to weight. This court has noticed the question, but has never found it necessary to decide which is the true construction. Mr. Justice Story, in his Commentaries, espouses the Hamiltonian position. [n12] We shall not review the writings of public men and commentators or discuss the legislative practice. Study of all these leads us to conclude that the reading advocated by Mr. Justice Story is the correct one. 

 

There is your Constitutional history lesson Doc. Happy 4th. 

Edited on Jul 4, 2018 1:17pm

Nothing there specifically about healthcare. Once again, you are wrong. You remind me of the charletons Jimmy Swaggert and Jim Bakker - you twist and define written material to suit your distorted thinking on topics that you have no clear understanding about - all to suit your personal desires. 


True, healthcare isn't mentioned specifically, but Hamilton's view of general welfare was expansive and that it encompassed anything that bettered the public wellbeing. I think it's pretty hard argument to make that healthcare doesn't promote the public wellbeing. Just as it's difficult to argue that providing for the common defense is limited to providing only the means of defense that were available at the time the constitution was written.

 

Anyway, the Supreme Court agrees with my "distorted thinking" and my "personal desires" on this issue, so it is the law of the land. 

 

Here is Hamilton in his own words.

 

The terms "general Welfare" were doubtless intended to signify more than was expressed or imported in those which Preceded; otherwise numerous exigencies incident to the affairs of a Nation would have been left without a provision. The phrase is as comprehensive as any that could have been used; because it was not fit that the constitutional authority of the Union, to appropriate its revenues shou'd have been restricted within narrower limits than the "General Welfare" and because this necessarily embraces a vast variety of particulars, which are susceptible neither of specification nor of definition.

 

The only qualification of the generallity of the Phrase in question, which seems to be admissible, is this--That the object to which an appropriation of money is to be made be General and not local; its operation extending in fact, or by possibility, throughout the Union, and not being confined to a particular spot.

Edited on Jul 4, 2018 5:34pm

Please, give it up. Your analogy is just a trite twisting of words. Enough already...

Originally posted by: David Miller

Please, give it up. Your analogy is just a trite twisting of words. Enough already...


Sorry, you don't agree with an expansive general welfare clause. Nevertheless, that is what we have. The founders saw providing for the general welfare to be just as important as providing for the defense of the country. 

 

"expansive general welfare clause" - there it is, the justification for giving it all away, as long as others pay for it.

Originally posted by: David Miller

"expansive general welfare clause" - there it is, the justification for giving it all away, as long as others pay for it.


Just the way our founding fathers intended. 

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