Local Hotels - New Stations Program: It Stinks

chrest

Dec 23, 2011
9:54pm

I've now experienced the new Stations program first hand, and I don't like it. I just got back from Red Rock on a 3 day comped stay using a mailed offer. A 3 day offer there or GVR is the same as before for me. But my free play and the number of free buffets have been cut in half. I had over 130,000 points before the program change, and they did not give me any compensation points. The 3X points for play are a joke as they've raised the prices in the restaurants (the buffet has increased by a third but the food quality has gone down (RR buffet never was very good)), and there is no more 25% food discount for gold card holders. You could always cash 1000 points for $1.00; that's nothing new. But the old 3X points days wre more valuable than the new 6X points days as it's really only 2X the usual points. The really valuable old 5X points on senior days are long gone. Even though my level of play actually increased on this trip, the same host who had comped meals for me in the past refused to to do this trip, and he even tried to charge me for one of the free days of my stay, which was outrageous. Stations also no longer gives you the features that go with the "resort fee," so, for instance, if you want wi-fi, or the use of the gym, you have to pay extra for them. They are also letting the RR hotel deteriorate (I had to change rooms while I was there), but I'll not bother going into that. I cashed out all of my points before I left and I'll not return to RR, or, probably, GVR either.

I realize that just about every place in Vegas has recently become less generous, but I think M is still a good place for me, and I like it there. Now I'm looking for a place to replace Stations. I'm thinking about Palms; any thoughts on that?

If Vegas continues to offer less for more (no matter how much they try to make less seem like more), I'll stop going altogether. Basically, I expect my gambling to pay for my rooms and meals, and I don't care for some low-end place, or a casino with lousy gambling, like Caesars properties. If I can't continue to get what I've been getting for years, it's not worth it to me to continue going to Vegas. There are very nice local casinos I could go to instead. What amazes me is that so many people continue to buy into the diminishing offers and declining quality of all things Vegas.

Calif.Loves.Vegas

Dec 24, 2011
1:15am

Block User

"What amazes me is that so many people continue to buy into the diminishing offers and declining quality of all things Vegas."

Not true.
Thanks for Your take on the program. Some others have voiced concerns too.
Comparing offers & programs is what its all about here. They're all constantly evolving & changing,
and the casinos TRY to make it in their favor.
Til we catch on & call them on it. Then they have the option to change back, evolve, or We move on.

suecasey

Dec 24, 2011
1:21am

Block User

"You could always cash 1000 points for $1.00; that's nothing new. "

Not true. You could NEVER cash out points before. You could use them for slot play, but not for cash.

If you believe you were not given a point grant at the time of the rollover to the new system, you should have spoken to the rewards center manager, who can look at your account and correct this if it's true. We've had others who questioned this, and it turned out they were given a lump sum of points and didn't realize it. The computer can show -- day by day -- how many points you had before and after the rollover (Sept. 15th).

Buffet prices have not increased since the new point system went into effect. Lunch prices went up by $1, but that was many months ago.

Offers have tightened up a bit for video poker players, something that's going on at many casinos around town. If you were playing 100% VP games, that would explain your host's being unable to comp you as much as you would have liked. Or perhaps you just didn't play enough. It's not difficult under the new system to achieve Platinum status, and if you didn't, then you weren't playing all that much.

The Palms has removed all of their good VP, by the way. Stations still have plenty of good games. And 6-point days are still better than what you get at other casinos, for the most part.

If you hadn't been there since the 5X points for seniors was in effect, then you've been gone a very long time, which could explain your decreased offers.

anniea

Dec 24, 2011
4:32am

Block User

I am on the fence, but wanted to say I love staying at Red Rock, and will continue to do so even with the changes.
My freeplay+3 nights+dining credit, and the 'used to be included' internet and Fitness center made me choose Red Rock every time. The whole package made for a very enjoyable 3 days.

My freeplay has been cut in half and I now have to pay for internet and the fitness center, but for now, it is still my first choice.
The 'little perks' were what made me feel like RR appreciated my biz and wanted me to keep coming. It also made me feel that they were 'giving' me these perks because I had 'earned' them from past visits.
I am at Prez level and not likely to go above that.
I have never asked my host to have a look at the end of my stay to see if anything can be 'taken off', but maybe that is now the way to go? Can internet and fitness be removed?

After a year of no room/freeplay offers from the Palms, they have resumed, and I will use this on my next trip (as well as RR, as we are staying 9 days).

I am still getting decent offers from the 'M', Harrahs (surprising, cause not that much play done), and SouthPoint.

The free rooms, freeplay and not much outlay for food, are the deciding factors on where we vacation. This next trip was going to be to Florida in Feb. 9 hotels nights, food, rental car and we would be at least $1800 out of pocket for Florida...With all the free room and food comps, rental car not needed.....we went with Vegas.

chrest

Dec 24, 2011
7:43am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: suecasey
"You could always cash 1000 points for $1.00; that's nothing new. "

Quote
Not true. You could NEVER cash out points before. You could use them for slot play, but not for cash.

.

I stand corrected on this. However, a dollar is a dollar, and Stations' cash back policies are no way near as generous as M if you play on weekends.

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If you believe you were not given a point grant at the time of the rollover to the new system, you should have spoken to the rewards center manager, who can look at your account and correct this if it's true. We've had others who questioned this, and it turned out they were given a lump sum of points and didn't realize it. The computer can show -- day by day -- how many points you had before and after the rollover (Sept. 15th).

I did this, thanks to a reply to a post you made some weeks ago. However, after wasting about 30 minutes with the rewards center manager, I was told there was nothing they could probably do about it, but she would open a review and contact me later. Neither she, nor anyone else, ever contacted about this.

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Buffet prices have not increased since the new point system went into effect. Lunch prices went up by $1, but that was many months ago.

This may be the case, as I haven't been there since the summer. However, they are now about one-third more expensive than they were the last time I was there. I must admit that I don't know the difference to the penny, because they gave me so many free buffets in the past I never needed to pay before this trip. And if I did run out of buffet coupons, I could get a host to comp it, or, at least, get 25% off with my gold card. For me, the number of coupons have halved, comps from a host are now non-existent, and why would I use points for food if there's no premium? As for the quality of the buffet, which was never very good, it's now very bad, certainly not worth $15.00 in my opinion. I was really struck that the buffet line was never long nor was the buffet ever very crowded, even on seniors' day when you could get it for half price points. In the past, I remember being grateful that my room key would act as a line pass as the lines were quite long; this time there was no line pass needed, and seating was immediate.

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Offers have tightened up a bit for video poker players, something that's going on at many casinos around town. If you were playing 100% VP games, that would explain your host's being unable to comp you as much as you would have liked. Or perhaps you just didn't play enough. It's not difficult under the new system to achieve Platinum status, and if you didn't, then you weren't playing all that much.

I do play VP, but mostly slots. From my point of view, the host's attitude was most likely because they've been told to cut back on giving things to players. As for it being "not difficult" to achieve Platinum status, you need to run through $40,000 in order to become Platinum, and all that gets you is what Gold status used to get you. I'm not interested in devoting all of my play to Stations (in fact I doubt I'll give them any play in the future), just to achieve a level of largess I used to have for being Gold. I could actually achieve Platinum in a few more days play, but I don't see the point of rewarding Stations for screwing its customers.

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The Palms has removed all of their good VP, by the way. Stations still have plenty of good games. And 6-point days are still better than what you get at other casinos, for the most part.

Well, that may well be the case; I need to check for myself. The Palms may not be the place to move to, but at least they have decent restaurants, which I don't think RR does, and I'm including restaurants other than the buffet and coffee shop in stating that. At the moment, M is, for me, the gold standard. Perhaps I should only stay there, but I would like a second place to go to in Vegas.

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If you hadn't been there since the 5X points for seniors was in effect, then you've been gone a very long time, which could explain your decreased offers.

I go to Vegas five or six times a year. For the past three years, I've always stayed at M for part of my trips, and at GVR or RR for the rest. I knew that the 5X senior days points had disappeared a long time ago; I just mentioned that this was the best deal on points Stations ever offered. The current 6X points days are a silly attempt to make Stations look generous when they're only really giving you double what you would get otherwise.

Sue, I don't know you, and I've enjoyed reading your posts and replies on this board over the years. Obviously, however, you are sticking up for your employer, who might end up not even managing Aliante in the future. For the past several years I was a big fan of Stations and quite happy with the way they ran things. The new program is terrible, in my opinion, and there is no question in my mind that the hosts have been told to be cheaper to players. The very idea that my host would try to charge me for an offer code-comped day is ridiculous, but he called me to let me know that he was going to do that. Stations is doing what so many other places in Vegas have done. It's a three-part program: 1) Overreach and overestimate the market by overbuilding and overpaying your executives; 2) File for bankruptcy and, as best you can, maneuver behind the scenes to get as much for yourself as you can (including blowing off debt: 3) Downgrade your players program and/or games and/or restaurants and/or hotel and/or offers, while raising prices and adding resort fees in order to squeeze as much out of the customers as possible. I've left other places in Las Vegas behind before when I've experienced declining offers and facilities, and, if necessary, I'm willing to stop going to Vegas altogether if this trend continues. I don't owe anything to the Frittata's or any other casino owners, and I'm tired of people defending what are obviously not only worsening situations for players but also obvious attempts to be more greedy. The casino industry was built by the very customers that most of them have been thumbing their collective noses at for the past several years, and I don't think people should support that. Perhaps what we need is a "Don't Occupy Las Vegas" movement.

suecasey

Dec 24, 2011
11:19pm

Block User

You do NOT need to run $40,000 through the machines to achieve Platinum status. If you are playing slots, you only need to run $13,000+ through. You get 3 status credits for every dollar played on slots. 40,000 status credits in a 6-month period = Platinum.

I am not defending the system because I work there. I happen to believe it's an excellent system, and as business is up, I believe many others do, too. If I were allowed to play with a card, I'd certainly play at Stations.

I also disagree with your assessment of Red Rock's restaurants. They have many good choices there. Have you tried Terra Rosa? It's my favorite Italian restaurant in town.

As far as buffets go, you should try Aliante's. It's excellent, and the prices have held steady for a long time. $4.99 for breakfast, $7.99 for lunch, $9.99 for dinner and Sunday brunch. The only reason you're thinking there's an increase is that you no longer get a discount with your Gold card. That's because of the new system, where everybody is earning so many more points than they used to (3 points per dollar played). There are many, many Platinum players now, under the new program. People who never thought they'd ever achieve President level are doing so. And I see our hosts in action all the time. They are very generous with comps for good players. Nearly everybody has at least a Gold card nowadays, since it costs almost nothing to achieve, so I'm not surprised your mailed offers have decreased. But hosts look at average daily (and trip) theo, and that's what determines what they can give you.

chrest

Dec 25, 2011
11:30am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: suecasey

Quote
You do NOT need to run $40,000 through the machines to achieve Platinum status. If you are playing slots, you only need to run $13,000+ through. You get 3 status credits for every dollar played on slots. 40,000 status credits in a 6-month period = Platinum.

You need 40,000 "status points" to become Platinum. If "status points" are the same as the 3X points you get for playing, then you would need to run $13,333 through the machines. I didn't realize that "status points" were the same as the 3X points. Checking my "status point" balance, I could easily make Platinum in a day, but I doubt I'll bother.

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I am not defending the system because I work there. I happen to believe it's an excellent system, and as business is up, I believe many others do, too. If I were allowed to play with a card, I'd certainly play at Stations.

Great. I'm glad to hear that for your sake and for all of the other Stations employees. But I don't like the new program, and I don't care for the way I was treated at RR during my last visit.

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I also disagree with your assessment of Red Rock's restaurants. They have many good choices there. Have you tried Terra Rosa? It's my favorite Italian restaurant in town.

I ate at Terra Rosa in June with a friend. We both thought the food was mediocre at best. The service, however, was excellent. Opinions on the quality of food, like many other things, is subjective.

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As far as buffets go, you should try Aliante's. It's excellent, and the prices have held steady for a long time. $4.99 for breakfast, $7.99 for lunch, $9.99 for dinner and Sunday brunch. The only reason you're thinking there's an increase is that you no longer get a discount with your Gold card. That's because of the new system, where everybody is earning so many more points than they used to (3 points per dollar played).

I don't get to that side of Vegas, but I'll take your word for it. As far as my experience goes, the best of Stations' buffets is at GVR.

Earning more points when they're worth less is meaningless, in my opinion.

I'm not interested in continuing to argue over the value of Stations new program. I don't like it, and I won't be going to Stations' properties in the future. I think the new program is a downgrade for most people, and that Stations is trying to make it look like it's something else. No matter how you cut it, everyone is getting less than they were in the past; even achieving Mogul status doesn't get you a free trip to the gym. If people are willing to lose more money to get what they got in the past for less, that's up to them. If you and others think the new program is great, I'm glad for you. But I think that, especially in this economy, many people will realize the negative realities of what Stations is doing.

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There are many, many Platinum players now, under the new program. People who never thought they'd ever achieve President level are doing so. And I see our hosts in action all the time. They are very generous with comps for good players. Nearly everybody has at least a Gold card nowadays, since it costs almost nothing to achieve, so I'm not surprised your mailed offers have decreased. But hosts look at average daily (and trip) theo, and that's what determines what they can give you.

Gee, I guess I'm not a "good player" by your and Stations' standards. I must be really lucky that M and other places are willing to comp me as they do. That you don't understand how insulting you are in the above quote amazes me, but I'm sure that most other people that read this post will see your vitriol.

Yes, hosts deal with comps based on theoreticals, and, in some places, actual wins and losses. You don't have to believe me when I tell you that I'm getting less (nothing on the last trip) for the same amount of play I've done in the past, and that my host even tried to charge me for a day that was part of a code-comped offer, but it's true.

There are many reasons why people gamble, and different people are willing to spend (lose) different amounts of money in that activity. I am not interested in increasing the amount I gamble merely to satisfy the requirements of a program that I think offers me declining value, or to live up to your idea of what a "good player" is. I don't even see how you can begin to assign moral qualifications to the act of gambling.

So let's agree to disagree. I think some readers might find my perspective more objective than yours as I'm a client as opposed to an employee. Nevertheless, if Stations' new program is as excellent as you think it is, then my experiences and opinions are certainly irrelevant.

suecasey

Dec 25, 2011
1:15pm

Block User

NEW SYSTEM: 1,000 points = $333 coin-in. This gets you $1 in comps.
OLD SYSTEM: 600 points = $600 coin-in. This used to get you $1 in comps (at Station-owned restaurants).

So tell me how "everyone is getting less than they were in the past" when it's so much easier to earn comps now.

Most people also seem very happy to be able to get cashback for the first time at Stations. This is a major improvement in the program.

Yes, we can agree to disagree. You're angry at how you perceive your treatment at RR. Everyone makes their judgments based on their individual experiences, and that's fine. And you're reading "vitriol" into my comments. There is none there. I'm too busy and tired to be that angry, especially after the constant long lines we had at the rewards center today, lol.

anniea

Dec 26, 2011
1:05am

Block User

Sue,
Do you know if a host can comp the Fitness center/Spa entrance fee?
Or internet?

(I understand each situation is different, based on play)

suecasey

Dec 26, 2011
9:36am

Block User

Yes, I believe they can, Annie. I get this impression from Lauren's trip reports (see the Trip Reports board), not from personal experience.

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