Caleb Hanie Debate

Tons of differences during the Campo years..all the defense was gone, Irvin was gone, ahh hell forget it... You're right, I'm wrong. Chan Gailey is the best coach in the NFL. A bust of him should be outside of every stadium for all to see and rub before entering a game.

[QUOTE=burger;38264]Tons of differences during the Campo years..all the defense was gone, Irvin was gone, ahh hell forget it... You're right, I'm wrong. Chan Gailey is the best coach in the NFL. A bust of him should be outside of every stadium for all to see and rub before entering a game.[/QUOTE] Ok. Thats all I wanted to hear. I will now print this post and hang it on my fridge. Im 1-0.

[QUOTE=6pounder;38265]Ok. Thats all I wanted to hear. I will now print this post and hang it on my fridge. Im 1-0.[/QUOTE] LOL... Good one. 1-0 Burger trails :)

[QUOTE=6pounder;38192]There are not many head coaches in the entire league I would rather have than Chan Gailey.[/QUOTE] I'm laughing my backside off after reading the competing Burger/6pounder posts. All the while I thought the statement quoted above meant that 6pounder agreed that there weren't many NFL head coaches other than Chan that he would rather have [U]at the poker table[U][/U][/U]! 6pounder, I obviously agree with Burger that Chan is a bad head coach, and will add only in support of that point that Chan has never been successful as a head coach at any level, so I think it's tremendously difficult to back the guy. I will agree though that he is a solid coordinator, but the NFL is replete with examples of guys who are incredible coordinators who aren't cut out to be head coaches. It's not Chan's fault - he's just not a head coach. Congratulations though on your victory over Burger.

[QUOTE=Cizzle;38366]I'm laughing my backside off after reading the competing Burger/6pounder posts. All the while I thought the statement quoted above meant that 6pounder agreed that there weren't many NFL head coaches other than Chan that he would rather have [U]at the poker table[U][/U][/U]! 6pounder, I obviously agree with Burger that Chan is a bad head coach, and will add only in support of that point that Chan has never been successful as a head coach at any level, so I think it's tremendously difficult to back the guy. I will agree though that he is a solid coordinator, but the NFL is replete with examples of guys who are incredible coordinators who aren't cut out to be head coaches. It's not Chan's fault - he's just not a head coach. Congratulations though on your victory over Burger.[/QUOTE] Cizzle, I respect you and Burger's opinions here. The first thing I would ask you to do however is tell me the Coaches we have in the NFL that are better than average. As a fan and an observer none of us really know for sure but I don't see many Bill Walsh or Bill Parcells coaches out there. My comment was that [B]there are not many coaches in the NFL that I would rather have than Chan Gailey.[/B] Obviously Bill Belicheck is one, maybe the 2 guys we have in the Super Bowl (I still have to see more from Both to be honest), Andy Reid, Some people like Rex Ryan and he has done very well the last 2 years. Who else? I like Coughlin I guess? Gruden? Hes great on MNF and a huge name now, maybe he would be better? Gailey has been successful at every stop. Lets not compare College to the pro game. I gotta believe its just as hard for a pro coach to suceed in college as vice versa. What are the expectations at Georgia Tech anyways? Look at the quarterback's who have played their best football under Gailey. Did anybody on this planet think that Ryan Fitzpatrick could be considered a somewhat capable starter in this league? I thought he was dog shit. He had opportunities to start with Cincinnati and I think he might have played a little in St louis also. Guess what, he is capable starter. In fact, I have been a Miami Dolphin fan my whole life and Ryan Fitzpatrick is better than every QB that team has had since Marino. I know that now and only after seeing what he can do in Gaileys offense. And Gailey coached in Miami also where he did a good job considering what he had to work with. I saw Roscoe Parish, a former high draft choice who was nothing but a bench player turn into a solid contributor. I saw this team compete with Baltimore and KC in two of the toughest stadiums to play in back to back weeks. Then they played the Bears (in Toronto) and should have won that game. They took the Steelers to OT!!!!!!!!I saw this team get better and better each and every week, the true sign of good coaching. Ryan Fitzpatrick??????????? Steve Johnson???????????? Roscoe Parish?????????????? 2 offensive tackles they picked up off the street?????????? The offense was dangerous. Can you name one GOOD player on their defense? Ok, can you name one player on their defense? You probably think Lovie should be fired also. Another coach who overachieved. Shit, he went to the Bowl with Rex Grossman. C'MON MAN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

6pounder, I respect your opinions as well. Although I disagree with you, you make very good points in support of them. See below... [QUOTE=6pounder;38367][B]The first thing I would ask you to do however is tell me the Coaches we have in the NFL that are better than average.[/B][/QUOTE] These are the coaches from the past season that I would rather have Gailey than, or are a "PUSH": 1. Singletary - possibly the worst head NFL coach I've seen since Rich Kotite. Gailey wins. 2. Josh McDaniels - too young and immature to be an NFL head coach right now. Gailey wins. 3. Lovie Smith/Jim Caldwell/Wade Phillips - aka "The 3 most likely NFL head coaches to die crossing the street at night because they got caught staring into an oncoming car's headlights." Gailey wins. 4. Gary "I invent new ways each year to donk away my season" Kubiak. Gailey wins. 5. Childress. PUSH. These are the coaches in my mind who the jury is still out on, who may wind up being worse than Gailey: Sparano, Garrett, Frasier, Raheem Morris, and the DEN and SF interim coaches. [U]At best[/U], that means I rank him 14th out of the 34 head coaches we had this past season. I would rather have every other coach from this past season than Gailey. [QUOTE=6pounder;38367][B]Gailey has been successful at every stop. Lets not compare College to the pro game. I gotta believe its just as hard for a pro coach to suceed in college as vice versa.[/B][/QUOTE] He's never won a playoff game as an NFL head coach despite having coached two playoff home games. As to his D-I college head coaching career, Burger previously addressed that. I'll only add that he was 2-4 in bowl games as the GaTech coach: '03 Humanitarian Bowl, 53-10 over Tulsa, and '04 Champs Sports Bowl, 51-14 over Syracuse. [QUOTE=6pounder;38367][B]What are the expectations at Georgia Tech anyways?[/B][/QUOTE] I'm not sure, but I don't think that when he interviewed, either he or GaTech said, "I/we have low expectations, don't care about beating GA, winning the ACC, going to a BCS bowl game, winning 10 games, or finishing in the top 25. I/we will accept moderate success." [QUOTE=6pounder;38367][B]Look at the quarterback's who have played their best football under Gailey. Did anybody on this planet think that Ryan Fitzpatrick could be considered a somewhat capable starter in this league? I thought he was dog shit. He had opportunities to start with Cincinnati and I think he might have played a little in St louis also. Guess what, he is capable starter. In fact, I have been a Miami Dolphin fan my whole life and Ryan Fitzpatrick is better than every QB that team has had since Marino. I know that now and only after seeing what he can do in Gaileys offense. And Gailey coached in Miami also where he did a good job considering what he had to work with. I saw Roscoe Parish, a former high draft choice who was nothing but a bench player turn into a solid contributor.[/B][/QUOTE] I acknowledge that he is a solid NFL coordinator. [QUOTE=6pounder;38367][B]I saw this team compete with Baltimore and KC in two of the toughest stadiums to play in back to back weeks. Then they played the Bears (in Toronto) and should have won that game. They took the Steelers to OT!!!!!!!!I saw this team get better and better each and every week, the true sign of good coaching. Ryan Fitzpatrick??????????? Steve Johnson???????????? Roscoe Parish?????????????? 2 offensive tackles they picked up off the street?????????? The offense was dangerous. Can you name one GOOD player on their defense? Ok, can you name one player on their defense?[/B][/QUOTE] I live in Western New York, but am not from here, and am not a BILLS fan. These are the sentiments of all of the die-hard BILLS fans who have lived here forever, and it is their biggest weakness. People in this area accept mediocrity, and it is killing them. Why? Because they keep selling out Ralph Wilson's stadium despite being sold an inferior product year after year. Ralph Wilson makes money hand over fist and has no incentive to improve his product. Instead, he just pockets all of the money he doesn't have to pay to quality coaches, management, or players. If BILLS fans would simply stop going to games, I gaurantee this team would get better. And, therein lies the problem. People here are fine with a "well, we tried hard" NFL football team. That doesn't fly in PIT, and is it any coincidence PIT wins year after year? The point is - at the highest levels, almost winning isn't good enough. Good teams and good coaches "just win, baby", no matter the circumstances. On the other hand, maybe your points above are signs of better things to come. Maybe we have this discussion again this time next year after a 10-6 BUF season. If so, I'll certainly give credit where credit is due. But Gailey has to win first. [QUOTE=6pounder;38367][B]You probably think Lovie should be fired also.[/B][/QUOTE] I do. And for the same reasons that Caldwell should be fired. CHI and IND win [U]despite[/U] their coaches.

[QUOTE=Cizzle;38370] I live in Western New York, but am not from here, and am not a BILLS fan. These are the sentiments of all of the die-hard BILLS fans who have lived here forever, and it is their biggest weakness. People in this area accept mediocrity, and it is killing them. Why? Because they keep selling out Ralph Wilson's stadium despite being sold an inferior product year after year. Ralph Wilson makes money hand over fist and has no incentive to improve his product. Instead, he just pockets all of the money he doesn't have to pay to quality coaches, management, or players. If BILLS fans would simply stop going to games, I gaurantee this team would get better. And, therein lies the problem. People here are fine with a "well, we tried hard" NFL football team. That doesn't fly in PIT, and is it any coincidence PIT wins year after year? The point is - at the highest levels, almost winning isn't good enough. Good teams and good coaches "just win, baby", no matter the circumstances. On the other hand, maybe your points above are signs of better things to come. Maybe we have this discussion again this time next year after a 10-6 BUF season. If so, I'll certainly give credit where credit is due. But Gailey has to win first. I do. And for the same reasons that Caldwell should be fired. CHI and IND win [U]despite[/U] their coaches.[/QUOTE] I live in Western NY and sometimes I also listen to the guys on WGR but they do not represent the thoughts of all people in the area. If the people of Buffalo did not go to the games the Bills would be gone. I truly believe that Ralph Wilson wants to win he just doesn't know how right now. Bottom line is we as fans are way to quick to pass judgement on these coaches. Lovie is a defensive guy and Chicago has been solid defensively for a while now. He is doing something right because I just watched his team play for a championship and they just might of won if not for a key injury. Bill Cowher, John Gruden, Bill Parcells everybody wants the high profile guy to be their coach. What does Pittsburgh do, they hire a young guy nobody has ever heard of who seems to coach with a chip on his shoulder. Maybe he feels he has something to prove, he is definately motivated. I gotta believe Gailey is motivated, if he doesnt succeed here he will probably never get another chance. I can only base my opinion of him from what I see on the field and that is improvement. Give the guy a chance. Maybe he is more cut out to be a coordinator but its to early to pass judgement now. In fact I think he should be praised for the job he has done so far.

I'm glad Coca-Cola went back to the original formula.

[QUOTE=burger;38373]I'm glad Coca-Cola went back to the original formula.[/QUOTE] No, no, no Burger. Me and 6pounder are cool - no need for unnecessary levity here. 6pounder - I agree with you that WGR is not a good barometer of the WNY sports community. Personally, I think WGR is so awful that I haven't listened to it once since early 2008 when I got XM radio in my car. I also agree that the Bills would leave if people boycotted - that's a very good point, and a reason why they shouldn't. I absolutley disagree though that Ralph Wilson cares about winning anymore. He can say all he wants at press conferences, but actions speak louder than words. There's a reason why BUF whiffs on so many draft picks - Ralph won't pay for anything more than a skeleton crew scouting department. There's also a reason why BUF doesn't even try to sign decent FA's - Ralph doesn't want to pay for it. Kawick Mitchell??? Remember when he was BUF's "big" FA signing. Curious though that the NYG didn't want him back after winning the SB. Remember who BUF also recently put on its bill boards to advertise season tix...George Wilson and Fred Jackson? Seriously - these are BUF's most marketable players? Remember the TO signing - a blind, deaf, and dumb football fan knew that was nothing more than a ploy to sell season tix and knew BUF wasn't going to re-sign TO even if he went for 1700 yards and 14 TD's. Ralph is not a guy who wants to win but doesn't know how - that's Al Davis (crazy), Jerry Jones (ego), and Danny Snyder (throw money at the problem). Ralph is a guy who opened the checkbook for 4 straight SB appearances, and wound up with nothing to show for it. I can't at all blame him for now just trying to make as much money as humanly possible for himself and his family. A more recent example of Ralph's bumbling is the news Jay Glazer broke on WC weekend about the Marshawn Lynch trade. NO told BUF that it would essentially match anyone's best offer for Lynch, and requested that it be given a right of last refusal as to Lynch. But, BUF fumbled again, didn't call NO before dealing Lynch to SEA, and missed out on what Glazer reported was the 3rd round pick NO would have given up for Lynch. ([url]https://www.rotoworld.com/content/playerpages/player_main.aspx?id=4186&sport=nfl[/url]). I put that squarely on Ralph not ponying up for quality management and operations people just like how he refuses to pony up for a quality HC. I also can't forget how Holmgren chose CLE over BUF, and Shanahan and Cowher both said no too. Maybe it was because Ralph is so cheap, or maybe it was because these guys thought the BILLS are hopeless, but, whichever, I put it on Ralph.

The Bills are one of the least profitable NFL teams. Chan was hired on the cheap.