Vegas Free-for-All - Breaking news!! Singer drops his escrow demand!

Breaking news!! Singer drops his escrow demand!

arcimedes

Jun 23, 2011
5:18pm

Quote

Originally posted by: BAGIANT
To call this guy a charlatan and a scam artist is ridiculous. He's not asking someone to pay a % of their profits if they win using his system. He's teaching people for FREE. He's spending his own gas money and time to meet someone to teach them for free. He's traveling about 300 miles from Phoenix to Vegas or Laughlin on his own dime.

He's teaching people how to LOSE and telling them it will help them win. Sorry, but if you can't recognize the problem with this then your opinion is pretty much worthless.

Quote
Originally posted by: BAGIANT
I guess if you want, you can call his "system" a Martingale system but is it really? I don't see him asking anyone to keep doubling their bet until they win. And that is EXACTLY what a Martingale system is. His is a progression of units that progress to a higher level. I just don't see anyone out there showing me something else that can help me win at VP other than the AP way. But I've seen too many AP players bite the dust and go broke. Some VP experts have folded up their tents and gone away and their websites are no longer there. So who's to say who's right. The one thing I'd like to see, is someone try Singers system out and then say it's an outright fraud. People mouth off about his system, but not ONE has ever said they tried it and it failed. WHY?

Not one person has ever stated they tried his system and won consistently over time. WHY?

I've ran thousands of computer simulations of Singer's system. Much better than people wasting their money. It works just like the math predicts. What a surprise. It's a scam and anyone who can do simple math knows it. Just because there are some people who can't add 2 and 2 does not change this fact.

Remember his silly claims of the 5th card throw away repeating itself. A group did go out and keep records and their results were exactly as random as expected. Same holds for anything and everything related to Singer. He lies and a few suckers believe him. Congratulations on being an easy mark.

MoneyLA

Jun 23, 2011
5:54pm

Block User

Arc, I am very curious about this: "I've ran thousands of computer simulations of Singer's system."

This is interesting. Do you know his special plays? Do you know when he moves to a higher denomination? And when he moves back to a lower denomination to bank his profit? Singer says he uses "special plays" only under certain circumstances when a particular win is needed. How did you factor these into your simulation?

I am also curious about this: "Not one person has ever stated they tried his system and won consistently over time." How do you measure "won consistently over time" ? Is it winning 3 out of 10 sessions (which is what I think you say you accomplish), and how much of a win is needed? Do you average the wins?

MoneyLA

Jun 23, 2011
6:19pm

Block User

Arc, are you sure you know how to balance your checkbook? you wrote:

"Do you believe $57,500 is a reasonable loss limit for a $2500 gain? Oh wait, I asked you this before and you ignored it. I guess you really do believe that's a good trade-off. Pretty much makes your opinion worthless."

My friend, if I spend 57,500 to win a profit of 2,500... I still have a profit of 2,500. And that profit of $2500 represents a gain of about 4.3% which is a nice return on 57,500 whether it comes in one day or two or even three days. In fact, my bank doesnt pay 4.3% for a full year of interest. So let's see... If I had to invest $57,500 every day to win 2,500... well... after a nice five day work week I'd show a gain of $12,500. You know, Singer might have something there.

Arc, you also said: "Tell us how much you've won since your last RF." Well, its true I havent had a royal flush in more than 82,000 hands played this year. Add a few thousand more hands played since my royal in December of last year. But I dont follow Singer's strategy, so I cant blame my lack of royals on Singer. But back to your question: "Tell us how much you've won since your last RF." Actually, thanks to a nice run of quad aces on bonus and TDB and quad 3s with a kicker for 10K on TDB, my bottom line is very attractive now. And when I add in about $700 of cashback, $1500 of free "show up money" on my last trip, and $1200 of Shell gas cards, plus more than 100,000 tier points earned in about 5 weeks playing bonus without a net loss during those five weeks... Im doing just fine, and thank you for asking. But whats your point: I dont follow Singer's strategy?

chipchik

Jun 23, 2011
7:27pm

Block User

Does Singer have his own website with his own followers who have testified that his "system" works?
How long has it been up? Does he tell ALL his info on his site for free as he keeps insisting he does not do it for the money. Are there pics with him and his winning students at the machines with their wins?
If so, please link it.

arcimedes

Jun 23, 2011
9:50pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA
Arc, I am very curious about this: "I've ran thousands of computer simulations of Singer's system."

This is interesting. Do you know his special plays? Do you know when he moves to a higher denomination? And when he moves back to a lower denomination to bank his profit? Singer says he uses "special plays" only under certain circumstances when a particular win is needed. How did you factor these into your simulation?

The net result of Singer's magical elixir ... er, I mean special plays is to reduce his ER. I looked at his special plays and reduced the probabilities of certain hands (like FHs) and increased the probabilities of quads. Overall I lowered the ER and guess what happened? His results got worse.

Quote
Originally posted by: MoneyLA
I am also curious about this: "Not one person has ever stated they tried his system and won consistently over time." How do you measure "won consistently over time" ? Is it winning 3 out of 10 sessions (which is what I think you say you accomplish), and how much of a win is needed? Do you average the wins?

My statement is simply a statement that no one has come forward and stated they have used Singer's approach for many years and been successful. Doesn't that tell you something? He's been doing this for at least 10 years, if his approach is so good shouldn't there be an army of Singer advocates singing his praise?

As for session wins ... it depends on how many levels he plays and the games he plays. At 5 levels he should win about 75% of his sessions. At 6 levels he wins around 80%. However, it does not change his results in the least since, like all negative progressive systems, the few losses are always so big it wipes out the smaller gains of his wins.

As for me ... I win about 40% of my sessions playing OEJs. For lower variance games the number goes down.

alanleroy

Jun 23, 2011
9:55pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA
My friend, if I spend 57,500 to win a profit of 2,500... I still have a profit of 2,500. And that profit of $2500 represents a gain of about 4.3% which is a nice return on 57,500 whether it comes in one day or two or even three days. In fact, my bank doesnt pay 4.3% for a full year of interest. So let's see... If I had to invest $57,500 every day to win 2,500... well... after a nice five day work week I'd show a gain of $12,500. You know, Singer might have something there.

That's assuming you never lose the $57,500. you're risking. You don't see the difference between risking your $57,500 at casino games and 'risking' it in the bank? Have I got an investment for you! You seem to be accepting that Singer's system works. Fine. Take me up on my challenge then. I want my five dollars.

arcimedes

Jun 23, 2011
10:01pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA
Arc, are you sure you know how to balance your checkbook? you wrote:

"Do you believe $57,500 is a reasonable loss limit for a $2500 gain? Oh wait, I asked you this before and you ignored it. I guess you really do believe that's a good trade-off. Pretty much makes your opinion worthless."

My friend, if I spend 57,500 to win a profit of 2,500... I still have a profit of 2,500. And that profit of $2500 represents a gain of about 4.3% which is a nice return on 57,500 whether it comes in one day or two or even three days. In fact, my bank doesnt pay 4.3% for a full year of interest. So let's see... If I had to invest $57,500 every day to win 2,500... well... after a nice five day work week I'd show a gain of $12,500. You know, Singer might have something there.

Unless your bank took away the $57,500 once in every 5 days and you had to replace it. Please try to make at least a little sense here. The $57,500 is what he risks EVERY TIME he gambles. That means he loses a large share of that bankroll (30-50K) once in every five times he plays. His average win is about $7K. This is not rocket science.

Quote
Originally posted by: MoneyLA
Arc, you also said: "Tell us how much you've won since your last RF." Well, its true I havent had a royal flush in more than 82,000 hands played this year. Add a few thousand more hands played since my royal in December of last year. But I dont follow Singer's strategy, so I cant blame my lack of royals on Singer. But back to your question: "Tell us how much you've won since your last RF." Actually, thanks to a nice run of quad aces on bonus and TDB and quad 3s with a kicker for 10K on TDB, my bottom line is very attractive now. And when I add in about $700 of cashback, $1500 of free "show up money" on my last trip, and $1200 of Shell gas cards, plus more than 100,000 tier points earned in about 5 weeks playing bonus without a net loss during those five weeks... Im doing just fine, and thank you for asking. But whats your point: I dont follow Singer's strategy?

No, the point is you can have long droughts. When those droughts hit you will have a higher percentage of losing sessions using Singer's approach. That means more of the $50K losses. How many of them could you afford?

For example, maybe you walk into the casino and hit AWAK right away. You are up $2K using his system but you still haven't reached the win goal. Now you play until it's all gone. You did get lucky and hit AWAK and you still lose $50K. Tell everyone how that makes so much sense. I can give more examples of how his system fails. It turns out that he will win when he hits at higher denoms and lose when he hits a low denoms. Over time this averages out (gee, it's random) and the net result is he will obtain the ER of the games he plays JUST LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.

Orderly

Jun 23, 2011
10:14pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: BAGIANT
Continuing following his columns, Rob told the story about hitting "X" amount of Royals in one day. I really don't remember if it was 3-4-5, but it was a big amount. Several posters on LVA Sports contested Robs hitting that many Royals in one day. For a wager, Rob said he would produce PROOF that what he said was TRUE, as he had offered on other wagers before, like how much he had won in the last 7 years. Well, Fezzik now got involved in the bet, and they agreed to meet in Vegas at a certain place and time. Sure enough, they all met, and Rob produced the PROOF they needed to show he had hit that many Royals in one day.

Could you provide a link to a reputable source that can validate that story? I've seen the same story many times but I've never been able to find any kind of verification of it. Surely there would be a post at LVA Sports about it where Fezzik admitted the proof was valid, but I can't find one. I think I've also seen a claim where he stated the editors of Gaming today saw proof of his wins but I've never seen an article in that publication which verifies that either. The only thing I've ever seen is claims that proof was made without anything that backs it up. Some form of verification would certainly go a long way towards authenticating Mr. Singer's declarations.

Jennifer

Jun 23, 2011
10:46pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA have too much to do.

judging by the amount of posts you make asking the same questions over and over and over, i dont think you do.

arcimedes

Jun 23, 2011
10:59pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: Orderly

Quote
Originally posted by: BAGIANT
Continuing following his columns, Rob told the story about hitting "X" amount of Royals in one day. I really don't remember if it was 3-4-5, but it was a big amount. Several posters on LVA Sports contested Robs hitting that many Royals in one day. For a wager, Rob said he would produce PROOF that what he said was TRUE, as he had offered on other wagers before, like how much he had won in the last 7 years. Well, Fezzik now got involved in the bet, and they agreed to meet in Vegas at a certain place and time. Sure enough, they all met, and Rob produced the PROOF they needed to show he had hit that many Royals in one day.

If the supposed proof was casino win/loss statements then we have a big problem. Singer often runs "education sessions" for multiple players at the same time. All these players would be using Singer's players card. The odds of multiple RFs now go up considerably and they would all show up on Singer's win/loss statement.

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