Vegas Free-for-All - did you say "affordable health care"?

did you say "affordable health care"?

snidely333

Nov 16, 2014
2:36am

Quote

Originally posted by: CowboyKell
Oh my poor PJ.....Statistics DO lie.

The biggest liars in the world are statisticians. Stats are easily skewed and translated to further ones point. I have used the power of perceived statistics many times in business to get my way. The actual numbers may be true but the presentation is the lie.

I'm a statistician and 82.4% of us think you're full of crap.

jatki

Nov 16, 2014
3:24am

Block User

I'm pretty sure the first hing we learned in stat. class was that they(statistics) can be manipulated in any way the statistician wishes for whatever outcome he wishes(to some extent anyway)

Boilerman

Nov 16, 2014
3:54am

Block User

Okay PJ, did Obama and friends fool you, or did you know about all of the lies?

Quote

Originally posted by: Boilerman
Obama and all of his friends happily lied, and Chilly, Forkie, and PJ don't care. Liberals believe some lies are good. Most Republicans understood these lies long ago, yet most Liberals and Independents bought the bull shit............hook, line and sinker.

Then there was the third group..........the Liberals who knew the truth and chose to lie, understanding that most Liberals and Independents are so stupid that they would believe this crap. PJ, Chilly, and Forkie, which of these where you?

hoops2

Nov 16, 2014
4:08am

Block User

Really? You want to throw out accusations of lies regarding the ACA? Never mind politicians lying. That's too easy. Lets review some of the whoppers told on these boards by our resident conservatives:
- Government panels decide who lives and dies - there are agencies being put in place to limit coverage
- the law was unconstitutional - a legal theory, not a lie
- No Congress ever used reconciliation to pass legislation before - never heard that one before, although it was snuck thru at midnight.
- Nobody would sign up for the plans cause nobody wants them- paid up enrollees is below the expected numbers
- Congress is exempt from Obamacare - I believe there were attempts to exempt congress
- Obamacare hands out insurance to illegal immigrants - illegals do have coverage
- The ACA forces companies to kill jobs - there are less full time jobs than when the law was enacted

For 6 years I've based my arguments on statistics and written law. - most of your quoted stats are wrong

During that same period I've been countered by people on this board using rumors, conspiracies, and entertaining stories about their best friend' sister's former roommate who got screwed somehow. Statistics don't lie. Campfire stories often do.

Obama is the one who won the lie of the year award

Boilerman

Nov 16, 2014
5:35am

Block User

This is data of ONLY one of several plans. I'm curious why the other plans aren't addressed here by PJ.

Also, once again, did PJ know Obama was lying about the plan? I did.

Quote

Originally posted by: pjstroh
Insurance premiums are going down by 6% in Boilerman's county of residence. I left lots of space below so Boilerman can fume about how awful this is for his life.

Interactive graph

pjstroh

Nov 16, 2014
6:48am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: Boilerman
This is data of ONLY one of several plans. I'm curious why the other plans aren't addressed here by PJ.

This thread was based on only one plan...and it wasn't even a plan from the individual market. I'm trying to find your objection to that...but I cant. All I can find is a huge fit about liberals and lies and stuff.

I posted a source that shows the law's effects across the country...including your hometown which it significantly benefits on the basis of cost reduction . What more can I possibly do? Perhaps I can tell a story about a friend. That seems to be your standard basis for arguing any point.

Quote
Originally posted by: Boilerman

Also, once again, did PJ know Obama was lying about the plan? I did.

There have been plenty of lies which any fact checking source can easily point out. Obama is guilty of some. And so are his critics. And so are you. Don't you think you should atone for your own lies before scolding other people about their's? Maybe you can start by admitting that your claim Obamacare adds to the deficit is false and based upon vitriol instead of data.

Boilerman

Nov 16, 2014
7:12am

Block User

I've spent little time researching the various Obamacare plans, but is PJ telling me that the Silver Plan is the only plan being offered, or is is possible that PJ and other Liberals are cherry picking favorable statistics? Since Obama and friends have quite a history of lying, misrepresenting facts, and structuring things which force government agencies into reporting a bunch of bull shit, I suspect that anything coming from this group's mouths is bull shit.

To not assume continued lies after tons of previous lies is downright stupid.

Quote

Originally posted by: pjstroh

Quote
Originally posted by: Boilerman
This is data of ONLY one of several plans. I'm curious why the other plans aren't addressed here by PJ.

Quote
Originally posted by: Boilerman

Also, once again, did PJ know Obama was lying about the plan? I did.

There have been plenty of lies which any fact checking source can easily point out. Obama is guilty of some. And so are his critics. And so are you. Don't you think you should atone for your own lies before scolding other people about there's? Maybe you can start by admitting that your claim Obamacare adds to the deficit is false and based upon vitriol instead of data.

malibber2

Nov 16, 2014
7:21am

Block User

Quote

The premiums may be going down but as I looked through the plans today it seems like the befits have gone down too. For example where there used to be a flat charge for a doctor's visit like$25 now it says $35 + 10% co-insurance and the 10% stays there even if you have satisfied your deductible for the year.

Prescription drug co-pays seem to have gone way up too. I am seeing a $35 per-prescription +10% on a lot of plans. I take 5 regular prescriptions so that is like an extra $210-$300 a month month in and month out in addition to the premium. Sorry PJ it looks like Obama has been doing some creative math to make the numbers look better. It would be interesting to see what the plans would cost with the same benefits as last year, but since all the plans have appeared to cut back on last year's meager benefits any comparison of costs isn't accurate.

pjstroh

Nov 16, 2014
7:30am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: Boilerman
I've spent little time researching the various Obamacare plans, but is PJ telling me that the Silver Plan is the only plan being offered, or is is possible that PJ and other Liberals are cherry picking favorable statistics? Since Obama and friends have quite a history of lying, misrepresenting facts, and structuring things which force government agencies into reporting a bunch of bull shit, I suspect that anything coming from this group's mouths is bull shit.

To not assume continued lies after tons of previous lies is downright stupid.

When did i say anything about the silver plan being the only one offered? I found published data and posted it. If you can find more data then be my guest. Fyi- Unverfiable stories about your friend, Nick, dont count as data.

you blast my sources without ever posting any of yours. Where are the fruits of your homework you claim to have done? I see nothing on this board from you except ideologic rants.