Vegas Free-for-All - Dodd Frank agency cacthes Wells Fargo in massive fraud

Dodd Frank agency cacthes Wells Fargo in massive fraud

BobOrme

Sep 20, 2016
11:29am

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Originally posted by: forkushV

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Originally posted by: alanleroyII
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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: alanleroyII
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Originally posted by: forkushV
And the Great Recession of 2007 was largely caused by criminal fraud. When Moodys rated subprime mortgages as AAA that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat. When Goldman hyped the value of collateralized debt options while simultaneously shorting them, that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat.

If you really want that kind of criminal fraud to go unpunished, vote Republican, because they want to gut the agency and get rid of enforcement.
Funny. You used to blame deregulation and the Repeal of Glass Steagall for the Great Recession. Now you blame 'criminal fraud'.

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Originally posted by: forkushV
Repealing Glass Steagall and letting the banks turn Wall Street and the home mortgage market into a big lottery caused the Great Recession. Us liberals opposed the repeal.

See....That was you back in 2014.

I wonder why you and your liberal ilk might have changed your opinion of what caused the 'Great Recession'....from 'Repealing Glass Steagall' to 'Criminal Fraud'...
Oh, there were multiple reasons for the meltdown. Allowing the banks to turn the home mortgage market into a big lottery. Criminal fraud by the ratings agencies and the banks. Repealing Glass Steagall (thanks Bill Clinton). The SEC not doing it's job. A clueless presidential administration ("The fundamentals of our economy are strong.").

With better and stronger cops on the beat, at least some of those things are now less likely. Thanks Obama.
Oh I see. So it was not 'largely' caused by criminal fraud...

Yes it was largely caused by criminal fraud; that's why I said it. If you're looking for an overarching cause of the meltdown, it was the misguided frenzy by both Democrats and Republicans toward deregulation. Everyone and every business reacts to incentives. When banks and their executives are incentivized to turn their businesses into lotteries, they will do so. Good regulations need to stop that.

By criminal fraud, do you mean mortgage banks being pressured by Democrats against any perception of redlining low income people, qualifying them for home loans that they couldn't possibly pay back?

A "clueless presidential administration"?

forkushV

Sep 20, 2016
12:19pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: BobOrme

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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: alanleroyII
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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: alanleroyII
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Originally posted by: forkushV
And the Great Recession of 2007 was largely caused by criminal fraud. When Moodys rated subprime mortgages as AAA that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat. When Goldman hyped the value of collateralized debt options while simultaneously shorting them, that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat.

If you really want that kind of criminal fraud to go unpunished, vote Republican, because they want to gut the agency and get rid of enforcement.
Funny. You used to blame deregulation and the Repeal of Glass Steagall for the Great Recession. Now you blame 'criminal fraud'.

Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Repealing Glass Steagall and letting the banks turn Wall Street and the home mortgage market into a big lottery caused the Great Recession. Us liberals opposed the repeal.

See....That was you back in 2014.

I wonder why you and your liberal ilk might have changed your opinion of what caused the 'Great Recession'....from 'Repealing Glass Steagall' to 'Criminal Fraud'...
Oh, there were multiple reasons for the meltdown. Allowing the banks to turn the home mortgage market into a big lottery. Criminal fraud by the ratings agencies and the banks. Repealing Glass Steagall (thanks Bill Clinton). The SEC not doing it's job. A clueless presidential administration ("The fundamentals of our economy are strong.").

With better and stronger cops on the beat, at least some of those things are now less likely. Thanks Obama.
Oh I see. So it was not 'largely' caused by criminal fraud...
Yes it was largely caused by criminal fraud; that's why I said it. If you're looking for an overarching cause of the meltdown, it was the misguided frenzy by both Democrats and Republicans toward deregulation. Everyone and every business reacts to incentives. When banks and their executives are incentivized to turn their businesses into lotteries, they will do so. Good regulations need to stop that.

Gee, I guess that's why there was a housing bubble and crash in Iceland, Ireland, and the UK. Or just maybe they had out of control bankers too.

In any case, the loans underwritten by Fannie and Freddie performed much better than those with private Wall Street securitization. So much for the theory of Bob Orme's source, "Proud to be Canadian."

BobOrme

Sep 20, 2016
12:42pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: forkushV

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Originally posted by: BobOrme
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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: alanleroyII
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Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
And the Great Recession of 2007 was largely caused by criminal fraud. When Moodys rated subprime mortgages as AAA that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat. When Goldman hyped the value of collateralized debt options while simultaneously shorting them, that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat.

If you really want that kind of criminal fraud to go unpunished, vote Republican, because they want to gut the agency and get rid of enforcement.
Funny. You used to blame deregulation and the Repeal of Glass Steagall for the Great Recession. Now you blame 'criminal fraud'.

Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Repealing Glass Steagall and letting the banks turn Wall Street and the home mortgage market into a big lottery caused the Great Recession. Us liberals opposed the repeal.

See....That was you back in 2014.

I wonder why you and your liberal ilk might have changed your opinion of what caused the 'Great Recession'....from 'Repealing Glass Steagall' to 'Criminal Fraud'...
Oh, there were multiple reasons for the meltdown. Allowing the banks to turn the home mortgage market into a big lottery. Criminal fraud by the ratings agencies and the banks. Repealing Glass Steagall (thanks Bill Clinton). The SEC not doing it's job. A clueless presidential administration ("The fundamentals of our economy are strong.").

With better and stronger cops on the beat, at least some of those things are now less likely. Thanks Obama.
Oh I see. So it was not 'largely' caused by criminal fraud...
Yes it was largely caused by criminal fraud; that's why I said it. If you're looking for an overarching cause of the meltdown, it was the misguided frenzy by both Democrats and Republicans toward deregulation. Everyone and every business reacts to incentives. When banks and their executives are incentivized to turn their businesses into lotteries, they will do so. Good regulations need to stop that.

By criminal fraud, do you mean mortgage banks being pressured by Democrats against any perception of redlining low income people, qualifying them for home loans that they couldn't possibly pay back?

A "clueless presidential administration"?

Deflection, as usual. The video is ALL Americans telling the world that we were headed into a dramatic financial disaster, cause by unregulated mortgage loan practices pushed by Chris Dodd and Barney Frank, along with most Democrats. You won't find this on MNBC...when you have to go to a source outside of America to show actual video of what people said back then, you have government controlled media in America. It wasn't but a few weeks ago that the current SoS scolded the media for reporting terrorist attacks. Stick you head back in the sand Bruce.

forkushV

Sep 20, 2016
1:02pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: BobOrme

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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: BobOrme
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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
And the Great Recession of 2007 was largely caused by criminal fraud. When Moodys rated subprime mortgages as AAA that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat. When Goldman hyped the value of collateralized debt options while simultaneously shorting them, that was criminal fraud, but there were no cops on the beat.

If you really want that kind of criminal fraud to go unpunished, vote Republican, because they want to gut the agency and get rid of enforcement.
Funny. You used to blame deregulation and the Repeal of Glass Steagall for the Great Recession. Now you blame 'criminal fraud'.

Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Repealing Glass Steagall and letting the banks turn Wall Street and the home mortgage market into a big lottery caused the Great Recession. Us liberals opposed the repeal.

See....That was you back in 2014.

I wonder why you and your liberal ilk might have changed your opinion of what caused the 'Great Recession'....from 'Repealing Glass Steagall' to 'Criminal Fraud'...
Oh, there were multiple reasons for the meltdown. Allowing the banks to turn the home mortgage market into a big lottery. Criminal fraud by the ratings agencies and the banks. Repealing Glass Steagall (thanks Bill Clinton). The SEC not doing it's job. A clueless presidential administration ("The fundamentals of our economy are strong.").

With better and stronger cops on the beat, at least some of those things are now less likely. Thanks Obama.
Oh I see. So it was not 'largely' caused by criminal fraud...
Yes it was largely caused by criminal fraud; that's why I said it. If you're looking for an overarching cause of the meltdown, it was the misguided frenzy by both Democrats and Republicans toward deregulation. Everyone and every business reacts to incentives. When banks and their executives are incentivized to turn their businesses into lotteries, they will do so. Good regulations need to stop that.

By criminal fraud, do you mean mortgage banks being pressured by Democrats against any perception of redlining low income people, qualifying them for home loans that they couldn't possibly pay back?

A "clueless presidential administration"?
Gee, I guess that's why there was a housing bubble and crash in Iceland, Ireland, and the UK. Or just maybe they had out of control bankers too.

In any case, the loans underwritten by Fannie and Freddie performed much better than those with private Wall Street securitization. So much for the theory of Bob Orme's source, "Proud to be Canadian."

Deflection, as usual...

No Bob, it was ridicule, as usual. If you want to try and prove it was Democrats pressuring banks (in Iceland?) that caused the meltdown , even though Freddie and Fannie loans far outperformed the private Wall Street securitized loans, go for it. But try a link from a credible source, or there will be more ridicule coming your way.

jatki

Sep 20, 2016
5:02pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: malibber2

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Originally posted by: CowboyKell
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Originally posted by: forkushV

With better and stronger cops on the beat, at least some of those things are now less likely. Thanks Obama.

Except that there are NOT better stronger cops on the beat.

The "cops" that are placed are sat down with so many free donuts in front of them they can see no crimes taking place.

It's a crappy, inefficient bureaucracy that only pretends to do the job that is very much needed.......Maybe that was the intention.

Interesting, all of the conservatives seem to be arguing that Dodd Frank is infective, so we need more regulation of big banks. I agree 100%. I think it is inexcusable and incomprehensible to conclude some 5,000 entry level employees all across the country were acting as rogue lone wolves unbeknownst to management. I think the Federal Government should pursue racketeering charges against WF, seize its assets and wind it down. That is the only way these bankers will learn a lesson.

I dont really want to agree with you here mal but I think I could. Unless someone givesme a propelling arguement that some WF execs dont see a little time and break the company up at least.personally I think all the WS banks should be broken up but thats a different arguement for a different day. TOO BIG TO FAIL should be nowhere even close to the heart and soul of this countrys economy. 20trillion in debt,one goes down whats to happen? we are F'ed thats what.

jatki

Sep 20, 2016
5:17pm

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: malibber2

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Originally posted by: jphelan
My understanding is this activity was ILLEGAL BEFORE DODD FRANK. I also understand Senators and Congressmen were getting customer complaints that credit ratings were affected for customers with "ghost accounts". I don't see how the outcome would have been any different with or without Dodd Frank. Dodd Frank is only for the banking industry. Are you arguing that Dodd Frank helped somehow with the VolksWagon malfeasance?

Generally speaking, wide scale fraud is always actionable on both the state and federal level. The problem is prosecutors and politicians don’t have the stomach to prosecute corporate crooks.

So, criminal acts are excused and low level scapegoats are offered up as a sacrifice along with promises to do better in the future. In other words, it is the whole too big to fail.

Hmmm.. a bit similar to some of the things that has happened with this current admin and dem nominee too,eh? I dont tgink either one ever heard of the buck stops here. Pass the buck? obviously.

CowboyKell

Sep 21, 2016
3:32am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: malibber2

Quote
Originally posted by: CowboyKell
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV

With better and stronger cops on the beat, at least some of those things are now less likely. Thanks Obama.

Except that there are NOT better stronger cops on the beat.

The "cops" that are placed are sat down with so many free donuts in front of them they can see no crimes taking place.

It's a crappy, inefficient bureaucracy that only pretends to do the job that is very much needed.......Maybe that was the intention.

This is the biggest difference between effective and ineffective.

A law is passed to prevent a wrong. The law is broken so you want another law passed against the wrong. The laws continue to be broken so you want more laws against the same wrong, and more penalties, and regulations on the penalties and laws. Now we need a big bureaucracy to oversee all these laws and regulations. Meanwhile the laws continue to be broken and nothing is done about it.
This is ineffective.

The conservative approach is to have one law against the wrong. Enforce the law.

daisybasket

Sep 21, 2016
3:40am

Block User

I don't even have time to write about the corruption in government and big business anymore, but a partial comment would be that...

I had a few bad dealing with Wells Fargo and knew their ethics and practiced were suspect for about 6-7 years. My Facebook rants to my friends prove it.

And second, I was a teen working at Sears and hey also had to pay millions due to credit card fraud issues and we were given five bucks for every card we opened and we were minimum wage workers. So yes, I can see where unethical practices would begin.

The corruption that is going unchecked and sweet under the rug is disgusting and then we wonder where the moral fabric had went. Very few people can stop from "if you can't beat em, join em" for so long. People do have to eat and you can't eat when crooks are stealing money and the system is broken for so long. I was very surprised at some actions during the housing crisis, but what are people supposed to do.

pjstroh

Sep 21, 2016
3:59am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: CowboyKell

The conservative approach is to have one law against the wrong. Enforce the law.

No - the conservative approach is to downsize the number of cops on the beat in the name of "small government" and then complain about the ensuing crimes that take place and how incompetent government is at enforcing the laws. Your posts are a perfect example of this disposition. And nothing embodies that philosophy more than the sequester put in place by our GOP-led Congress.

In any event - the regulatory body created by the vicious Dodd-Frank law has yielded results. And it sure makes the sour-puss Obama critics none too happy.

hoops2

Sep 21, 2016
4:07am

Block User

Who has called for smaller police forces?

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