Vegas Free-for-All - harrahs does more to hurt VP AP

RoadTrip

May 2, 2011
3:32am

Quote

Originally posted by: thlf
What I don't get is how does Jean Scott keep getting 7 star status year after year with the limited options in LV. How does she find a good play?

Maybe you should pose that question directly to her column comments. I'd be curious how she answers, if she answers.
:::shrug:::

Liondownnow

May 2, 2011
4:09am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: melbedewy

Quote
Originally posted by: MoneyLA
Isnt WOF set and managed by IGT? And the casinos have no control over the odds, payouts, etc??

That's not my point. My point is that people will voluntarily sit down and play 91% machines, which tells HET that most people are unmitigated suckers. Hence the flourishing of 6-5 "blackjack", SP 21, Casino War, Caribbean Stud, etc., etc.

It may not have been your point but it was your example. Why mention it when it doesn't apply?

I suspect most people come to vacation in Las Vegas and aren't getting wrapped up in the payouts and advantages. It is more about escaping reality to enjoy drinks, shows, and a little gaming. CET is smart enough to offer these folks free rooms with little play. They feel overjoyed with getting free rooms (not offered at other vacation locations) and they don't get wrapped up in the payout schedules. It isn't hard to see why the system works out so well for CET.

MoneyLA

May 2, 2011
6:23am

Block User

I dont follow Jean Scott but if she does have 7Star does she only play VP ??

MoneyLA

May 2, 2011
6:32am

Block User

I play at Caesars because I enjoy Caesars. I dont play for comps and I dont play for cash back... because they eliminated it. I do get comps because of my level of play, but I don't push for comps.

There is nothing wrong with the craps at Caesars, in fact its probably better than any other casino because it has the best dealers and certainly the most cordial dealers -- and Ive played most other places.

the craps pit at Caesars is well situated, plenty of room and youre not cramped. table sizes are good -- no "aircraft carriers." lighting is good. air quality is about as good as you can hope for if youre a non smoker -- but Bellagio does have non smoking tables.

I only wish Caesars had $10 tables the way Bellagio has.

You can complain about the VP at Caesars but you cant complain about the craps pit. There is no shorting of the pay schedule in craps, either.

Since I dont need my VP play to support my income I can play a reduced pay table and enjoy it. But would I be better off if Caesars had better VP pay tables? Yes. And have I said something to management? Yes. And did they care? Apparently not. LOL So I live with it and enjoy Caesars for everything else.

Slapinfunk and I have discussed getting our VP fix at other casinos the next time we are in Vegas. But I'll keep playing craps at Caesars.

suecasey

May 2, 2011
6:41am

Block User

Jean Scott asked me to tell you that she will address this subject and answer your questions on her blog tomorrow (Tuesday). https://jscott.lvablog.com/

melbedewy

May 2, 2011
9:21am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA
I play at Caesars because I enjoy Caesars. I dont play for comps and I dont play for cash back... because they eliminated it. I do get comps because of my level of play, but I don't push for comps.

There is nothing wrong with the craps at Caesars, in fact its probably better than any other casino because it has the best dealers and certainly the most cordial dealers -- and Ive played most other places.

the craps pit at Caesars is well situated, plenty of room and youre not cramped. table sizes are good -- no "aircraft carriers." lighting is good. air quality is about as good as you can hope for if youre a non smoker -- but Bellagio does have non smoking tables.

I only wish Caesars had $10 tables the way Bellagio has.

You can complain about the VP at Caesars but you cant complain about the craps pit. There is no shorting of the pay schedule in craps, either.

Since I dont need my VP play to support my income I can play a reduced pay table and enjoy it. But would I be better off if Caesars had better VP pay tables? Yes. And have I said something to management? Yes. And did they care? Apparently not. LOL So I live with it and enjoy Caesars for everything else.

Slapinfunk and I have discussed getting our VP fix at other casinos the next time we are in Vegas. But I'll keep playing craps at Caesars.

Kind of hard to gaffe craps....but I'm sure someone at HET is trying to come up with some method.

MoneyLA

May 2, 2011
10:01am

Block User

there are things that some casinos do to hurt players at craps:

1. place a big 6, big 8 bet on the layout
2. use longer tables
3. enforce the pick them up and throw them policy
4. make players pay the vig buy-4 and buy-10 in advance -- when booking the bet
5. keep all the players on one end of the table to save on a second dealer

these are mostly subtle ways to hurt players... not easily recognized the way pay tables can be viewed on a VP machine.

melbedewy

May 3, 2011
3:19am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA
there are things that some casinos do to hurt players at craps:

1. place a big 6, big 8 bet on the layout
2. use longer tables
3. enforce the pick them up and throw them policy
4. make players pay the vig buy-4 and buy-10 in advance -- when booking the bet
5. keep all the players on one end of the table to save on a second dealer

these are mostly subtle ways to hurt players... not easily recognized the way pay tables can be viewed on a VP machine.

Everything you list either involves sucker bets which no one is forced to make or those trying to cheat by making controlled rolls.
Craps can not be gaffed for the average player who makes line bets with double or triple odds. Even by HET, cause if they could do it, they would.

MoneyLA

May 3, 2011
3:48am

Block User

youre wrong here, melbedewey: "those trying to cheat by making controlled rolls"

controlled throws are not cheating. period. if you still question it, ask the Nevada Gaming Commission. Or just do a simple Google search for all of the articles and quotes from the NGC.

RoadTrip

May 3, 2011
5:03am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: MoneyLA
youre wrong here, melbedewey: "those trying to cheat by making controlled rolls"

controlled throws are not cheating. period. if you still question it, ask the Nevada Gaming Commission. Or just do a simple Google search for all of the articles and quotes from the NGC.

The NGC may not consider "controlled throws" technically as cheating. Neither is card counting "cheating" under the law.

But the casino's obviously consider it "cheating" and trespass many players each year. You yourself have acknowledged being trespassed from at least one major casino company.

So, in the casino's way of thinking, it is "cheating", but since the law says "NO", they use their right to deny service to anyone without the requirement of giving any reason for labeling you a "cheat" in their system.

Otherwise, why would you be "banned" from their properties? Seems the possibility of bad "PR" from a "celebrity" and "millionaire" should have weighed heavily into their decision.

We all know it's pretty difficult to be permanently banned or trespassed from a property, much less a group of properties in Vegas unless they consider a person to be a cheat, thief, major troublemaker, or person with criminal intent.

I've been in a "bruhaha" inside a casino before, and been told to leave for 24 hours. This has happened several times to me over 40+ years. Yet, I've never been "trespassed" or banned.

BUT, if they think a person is cheating, actually "stealing from them", banning that player is often the choice the casino will make.

:::shrug:::

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