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Roulette Man
Roulette Man
Apr 9, 2016
1:20am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
California has a 9.3% tax rate...
Stop right there; the state income tax is not the only tax people pay. And including all state and local taxes, the wealthy in California pay the same rate that the middle class does in Texas.

I guess they should call Texas the "soak the middle class" state.


Hey genius. Texas doesn't have any individual state income taxes.
No shit.

But a family with a $45,000 income will typically pay a total of 8.1% of their income in sales and excise and property taxes. The top 1% in Texas pay 2.9% of their income in total state and local taxes. And neither of those numbers include a non-existent income tax (duh!).



I sure hope you are not a numbers guy. I'd be broke if I ever listened to you. Talk about being totally dense.
alanleroyII
alanleroyII
Apr 9, 2016
2:12am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
California has a 9.3% tax rate...
Stop right there; the state income tax is not the only tax people pay. And including all state and local taxes, the wealthy in California pay the same rate that the middle class does in Texas.

I guess they should call Texas the "soak the middle class" state.


Hey genius. Texas doesn't have any individual state income taxes.
No shit.

But a family with a $45,000 income will typically pay a total of 8.1% of their income in sales and excise and property taxes. The top 1% in Texas pay 2.9% of their income in total state and local taxes. And neither of those numbers include a non-existent income tax (duh!).



I sure hope you are not a numbers guy. I'd be broke if I ever listened to you. Talk about being totally dense.
For those interested in the Raw numbers here's how they work out from the Texas Details above...

The Lowest 20% Pay $1,075 in Sales Taxes Per Year
The Highest 1% Pay $18,263 in Sales Taxes Per Year
Fair?

The Lowest 20% Pay $475 in Property Taxes Per Year
The Highest 1% Pay $38,352 in Property Taxes Per year
Fair?

Forkush and many others believe that for this to be truly fair, when the lowest 20% pay $1550 in combined sales and property tax, the top 1% must pay $226,460.

I'd rather just cut the fat out of Government so it can be funded on current levels of income tax. Then, no-one pays those unfair sales, property and use taxes based on a fixed percentage rather than a progressive income tax where the rich pay their 'fair share'. It's a win/win.
Boilerman
Boilerman
Apr 9, 2016
2:38am
Block User
Nice job of putting this information together, Alanleroy. One thing that I've noticed is that Forkie's "fair share" is an EVER increasing taxation number for the rich.
Roulette Man
Roulette Man
Apr 9, 2016
2:42am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: Boilerman
Nice job of putting this information together, Alanleroy. One thing that I've noticed is that Forkie's "fair share" is an EVER increasing taxation number for the rich.


He continues this charade, when the ironic thing is that he doesn't pay his fair share of taxes.

billryan
billryan
Apr 9, 2016
3:10am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: Roulette Man
California has a 9.3% tax rate...
Stop right there; the state income tax is not the only tax people pay. And including all state and local taxes, the wealthy in California pay the same rate that the middle class does in Texas.

I guess they should call Texas the "soak the middle class" state.


Hey genius. Texas doesn't have any individual state income taxes.
No shit.

But a family with a $45,000 income will typically pay a total of 8.1% of their income in sales and excise and property taxes. The top 1% in Texas pay 2.9% of their income in total state and local taxes. And neither of those numbers include a non-existent income tax (duh!).



I sure hope you are not a numbers guy. I'd be broke if I ever listened to you. Talk about being totally dense.
For those interested in the Raw numbers here's how they work out from the Texas Details above...

The Lowest 20% Pay $1,075 in Sales Taxes Per Year
The Highest 1% Pay $18,263 in Sales Taxes Per Year
Fair?

The Lowest 20% Pay $475 in Property Taxes Per Year
The Highest 1% Pay $17,352 in Property Taxes Per year
Fair?

Forkush and many others believe that for this to be truly fair, when the lowest 20% pay $1550 in combined sales and property tax, the top 1% must pay $226,460.

I'd rather just cut the fat out of Government so it can be funded on current levels of income tax. Then, no-one pays those unfair sales, property and use taxes based on a fixed percentage rather than a progressive income tax where the rich pay their 'fair share'. It's a win/win.



A question on these figures. I would think that a great many in the lower 20% dont own their residents so the rent they pay is used by someone else to pay the property tax.
For example- someone in the top 1% owns 500 apartments. Are they credited for all that property tax and the 500 families living in them get no credit? That would skew those numbers big time.
alanleroyII
alanleroyII
Apr 9, 2016
3:46am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: billryan

A question on these figures. I would think that a great many in the lower 20% dont own their residents so the rent they pay is used by someone else to pay the property tax.
For example- someone in the top 1% owns 500 apartments. Are they credited for all that property tax and the 500 families living in them get no credit? That would skew those numbers big time.

I just used the numbers as presented, but there may be many issues with their calculation method. In fact I just realized I made an error on the top 1%'s property tax. They pay 38K per year not 17K.

But the table says "Property Tax on Families", so I'm guessing they gave the low income renters credit for the property tax paid by the landlords. But that's a guess. Also how did they calculate the sales tax amount? How did they know the taxable purchases of rich and poor...what's that based on?

Boilerman
Boilerman
Apr 9, 2016
4:18am
Block User
I dispute Billy's point that property tax on the rich guy's 500 rental apartments would be included on Rich Guy's personal tax return. These properties would be held in numerous LLC's, and the property tax would be captured on these corporated returns. I do, however, agree with Billy's comment that these property taxes are fully or mostly being passed on and indirectly paid by tenants.


Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: billryan

A question on these figures. I would think that a great many in the lower 20% dont own their residents so the rent they pay is used by someone else to pay the property tax.
For example- someone in the top 1% owns 500 apartments. Are they credited for all that property tax and the 500 families living in them get no credit? That would skew those numbers big time.

I just used the numbers as presented, but there may be many issues with their calculation method. In fact I just realized I made an error on the top 1%'s property tax. They pay 38K per year not 17K.

But the table says "Property Tax on Families", so I'm guessing they gave the low income renters credit for the property tax paid by the landlords. But that's a guess. Also how did they calculate the sales tax amount? How did they know the taxable purchases of rich and poor...what's that based on?


billryan
billryan
Apr 9, 2016
4:27am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: billryan

A question on these figures. I would think that a great many in the lower 20% dont own their residents so the rent they pay is used by someone else to pay the property tax.
For example- someone in the top 1% owns 500 apartments. Are they credited for all that property tax and the 500 families living in them get no credit? That would skew those numbers big time.

I just used the numbers as presented, but there may be many issues with their calculation method. In fact I just realized I made an error on the top 1%'s property tax. They pay 38K per year not 17K.

But the table says "Property Tax on Families", so I'm guessing they gave the low income renters credit for the property tax paid by the landlords. But that's a guess. Also how did they calculate the sales tax amount? How did they know the taxable purchases of rich and poor...what's that based on?



That was going to be my second question. In NY, a portion of the sales tax is kicked back to the locale that it is generated from. Around here, Garden City and Manhasset are two of the wealthier areas, and since they also contain the two biggest malls, they get more ST revenue than the less affluent surrounding areas without malls.
On the other hand, Sands Point, one of the nations richest zip codes has no commercial property so they get zero back. NY has tried setting up Outlet Malls in poor neighborhoods,to stimulate both sales tax and jobs, but they've been more failure than success.

Ellen Locke
Ellen Locke
Apr 9, 2016
5:30am
Block User
What kind of pizza?
billryan
billryan
Apr 9, 2016
5:48am
Block User
NY style Neapolitan .
The only kind that matters.
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