Muliple Free Play offers that demand hotel stay

MoneyLA you aren't an idiot, you just portray one in the LVA Forums.

I was very slow to catch on but it is very clear to me now that you know what you are doing and what games you are playing when you make your posts. I find you very entertaining and appreciate that you reply to all and avoid the name calling. That being said I'm not buying much of what you are selling. I can't see a successful man like you not comprehending simple arguments on this forum.

Thanks for the entertainment.

Lion: I understand all of the simple arguments because, they are as you say, simple. And they rub me the wrong way. I would not double book-- I think that is cheating and I don't cheat. I've always been honorable in my profession and in my business and there are people on this forum who know who I am.

I know that casinos dont want you to double book because their offer is meant to entice/reward you for staying at their property. Yes, I know some of the posters claim that they gamble away more money than the free play is worth. If that is true, then good-- keep doing it. But then I scratch my head and wonder how smart can these people be to accept $100 of free play only to go in to the casino and lose more than that and not even take advantage of the free room deal? Makes no sense to me. Instead, save that comp "credit" for another time, instead of burning your comp now when you really don't need it for that particular Vegas trip.

Yes, casino/hotel companies are cutting back on promotions and comps and cutting workers because costs are too high and business isnt good. If you do what Singer does, and what Snidely admits he did, the casino is losing money on you. If you think this is "getting back" at the casinos and this gives you pleasure, continue doing it.

Even though some will consider me a high roller, even I have seen my comps and free play offers cut back while my gambling budget has not been reduced. So, I think I'm being hurt by the slowdown in overall business and rising costs which is why I turn off the lights in my hotel room when I leave, I turn off the water while brushing my teeth, and I certainly don't tie up multiple hotel rooms when Im not entitled to. But, I do use my comps appropriately and when I hosted a holiday get together and needed 6 rooms at one hotel I got them using my appropriate comps at that single property.

the only thing Im trying to sell is that Vegas is a good thing-- but it is not as good as it used to be. And if we want to hold on to "what's left" we have to be aware that these are businesses and businesses make cuts when things dont go their way. Im afraid that booking multiple rooms and doing what Singer talks about (which I suspect most multi bookers really do, if they admitted it) will lead to bigger cuts. Even those of us who don't multi book are seeing the cuts and I want the big shopping sprees and free play offers to return.

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MoneyLA, I think you are missing a part to all of this. Many are going for the free play (not the required room) but by no means are they going there to lose. I think starting with an extra $200 or so improves their advantage against the house at least a little. They are gambling in hopes of a win and the free play simply increases their chances of doing it. I think they are hoping to gamble for several hours at a casino they clearly like (hence the comped room and free play offer) and hoping to actually play several hours and WIN. The casino is getting a fair shake because they are staying and playing for hours. I didn't see anyone say they checked in for free play and planned to lose. I'm sure you gamble in hopes of winning just like they do.

Most if given a choice would prefer to play at a casino that is starting them with some free play versus a casino offering them nothing. In both cases the player is hoping to win. Funds likely will last longer at the casino that offers the free play.

I think the other type of gambler you are mentioning will not be receiving future offers. Casinos are pretty good at keeping their house advantage so why worry about it? Do you really fear that people are going to check in over and over to exploit these offers and the casinos will never catch on?

Lion, if as you say they are giving the casino a fair session of play, then there is no disagreement. What I am talking about and what I think Singer is talking about is a practice where players will go into a casino with their "free play" and run through their free play cashing out their wins and bolting. As I noted earlier you could take a free play offer to VP and be pretty safe in assuming you will get back in cash at least half of the free play amount.

But again this question: why would you burn your comps and use a "hotel offer" when you arent actually going to stay in the hotel room? Every time you use a room comp it goes against your "comp bank" (and that is a term I created for illustration purposes). Why not save that room offer for a future trip?

Some casinos increase your offers when youve been a good player and don't show up for awhile. Caesars (Harrahs) is famous for this. A good way to "fool" the computer at Caesars (Harrahs) is to make a short stop at one of the casinos (drop in, not stay there), play through a couple hundred in a high limit slot ($25 and up) and leave. This marks you as a high roller and the computer will target you for big offers to get you back.

And yes, I think the casinos are catching those who exploit offers. But the reality is that all players get cut in addition to those who "exploited" the deal. I know that my free play and shopping offers have dropped by about half in the last six months. And my play is way ahead of where it was at this time a year ago, based on my tier score.

Money, you seem to be one of the more interesting posters here and one of the few I'd be really interested in knowing, but I agree on a number of subjects you are indeed the "forum idiot". That being said, on this subject I completely agree with you. When I get a free room I'm gonna sleep there and I'm gonna gamble there. If it means passing up free play at another property, so be it.

MoneyLA...While I can't say I agree with you, I do understand your position. As I understand it, you feel when you are given an offer of freeplay money requiring check-in, the unstated assumption is that you will be staying in the room. If this is what the casino wants you to do in order to get the freeplay money, they should come right out and say it. Granted, it would be very difficult to enforce, but it would avoid a lot of assumptions. I don't say you're wrong for feeling the way you do, but the casinos are very specific about other requirements for some of their offers and it doesn't make sense to me that if this is what they want, they're not coming out and saying it.

Question of clarification to you...you made reference to your comped room coming out of your 'comp bank.' Now, while I'm nowhere near being a high roller, the last time my wife and I were in LV (year and a half ago), we used whatever comps we had accumulated in the hotel restaurants. The day before checking out we stopped by the front desk and asked if we had any comps left that could be used for our room. The clerk referred us to the casino host office and anything that could be done would be handled there. When we did this, the hotel comped us our entire stay. When I asked about this, I was told that the offer for rooms was separate from the comps accumlated while playing. While they did check our play, this was what determined what they could do for the room, not any 'comp dollars' we had left in our 'comp bank.' Is this normal, or are room offers normally given based on how many comp dollars you have remaining? The reason I'm asking is that I definitely don't have any comp dollars left at this point, but when I called the same hotel to book a trip me and a couple of friends are making to LV in May, they offered me a free room for our stay.

I have refrained from posting further because there's no way MoneyLA, Slapinfunk, or Kaypea will be convinced of anything other than their misguided views, but I have to at least say a few things.

Some of us live close enough to drive in monthly and have tons of offers for all kinds of places that we want to use and can only do so by double/triple booking.

There are places I like to play, but I will not stay in their rooms (which I've said before).

If you think dropping in and playing a few hundred in the $25 machines is going to make you look like a high roller, forget it. If you're already a player in that system it's going to be a SHORT PLAY day and will affect your daily average, and therefore, your offers.

Offers aren't going down now because people are double-booking. They're going down because of the economy. Stop playing the blame game.

Please use some common sense.

It will take Money and myself longer to check in and pee than playing through $300...