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Nationwide Crime Wave

forkushV
forkushV
Jun 2, 2015
4:17am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: DonDiego
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: hoops2
"Wait, are you really saying that schools that pick and choose the very best students with the most motivated parents actually get higher test scores??????"

As usual forky is wrong. Student at NYC charter schools are chosen by lottery. Anybody can apply & students are accepted covering the full range of aptitude.
And then they expel kids at double the rate of regular public schools. And they end up with better behaved students and, amazingly enough, higher test scores.
[No reference, . . .as usual - DD]

******quote***
Schools say suspensions maintain order, keep children safe, and allow teachers to focus on instruction by removing the most distracting students. Strict discipline has long been a cornerstone of the charter-school movement, and supporters argue that those policies have led to better academic outcomes for a majority of their students.
“Many families are flocking to charter schools, and one reason is that they believe in stricter discipline,” said Eva Moskowitz, founder and CEO of Success Academy, whose nine schools in 2011-12 suspended 17 percent of their students at least once. “Having some kids miss a day of instruction here and there for a suspension is far outweighed by the benefits of learning in an orderly environment all of the other days, as our academic results prove.”
***endquote***
Ref: ny.chalkbeat.org

Perhaps if the "regular public schools" expelled/suspended more violators their students would also demonstrate better behavior and higher test scores. Those not suspended would get a better education.
DonDiego, a suspension just means some kids miss a day of instruction here and there. But when students get EXPELLED from charter schools they are removed from their school forever (and probably shuttled back to a public school - resulting in lower test scores for them). Anyone who would conflate the two to win an internet argument is fundamentally dishonest.

So I think you should revise your post.
hoops2
hoops2
Jun 2, 2015
4:42am
Block User
And what are the expulsion rates in NYC?
alanleroy
alanleroy
Jun 2, 2015
5:19am
Block User
That's why the inner-city poor children with little parental supervision need to go to boarding schools in the middle of New Mexico or Wyoming or far away from the inner-city....and when they are still young enough to fix. Then you aren't dealing with expulsions of gangsters or overcoming years of bad influences.....just forming the clay.

We're never going to really fix this unless those kids get out of that terrible environment. Some parents help their kids succeed in spite of the difficulties ...a few kids will learn regardless of the environment.....but a good percent of them are just trapped in a cycle of poverty with little chance of escape and a new lost generation of throwaways.

How about schools like the New Mexico Military Institute...only for K-12 and designed to address educating impoverished children? NMMI's annual price per student is a mere $11,732 and that Includes Tuition, Room, Board and Uniforms.

https://www.boardingschoolreview.com/school_ov/school_id/455

Something big has got to change to break the cycle. We just don't seem to be able to fix the parents or the public schools. The only answer is to change the kids....the best way to do that is to move them to a better place where they can really learn. It would take a generation, but it could be the last generation born into poverty.

Don
Don
Jun 2, 2015
5:57am
Block User
DonDiego, a suspension just means some kids miss a day of instruction here and there. But when students get EXPELLED from charter schools they are removed from their school forever (and probably shuttled back to a public school - resulting in lower test scores for them). Anyone who would conflate the two to win an internet argument is fundamentally dishonest.

So I think you should revise your post.
i. DonDiego is not arguing, . . . just presenting facts with references.

ii. DonDiego will allow the reader to interpret the applicability of his post as originally written. But DonDiego thanks forkushV for his suggestion.

Don
Don
Jun 2, 2015
6:15am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroy
We're never going to really fix this unless those kids get out of that terrible environment. Some parents help their kids succeed in spite of the difficulties ...a few kids will learn regardless of the environment.....but a good percent of them are just trapped in a cycle of poverty with little chance of escape and a new lost generation of throwaways.

Unfortunately some cities are instating policies directly opposite to those recommended by the ever perceptive alanleroy.

The Minneapolis schools have contracted with a California organization entitled the Pacific Educational Group [PEG] to indoctrinate its school teachers and staff and students in something called "white privilege". The intent apparently is to shame the white teachers, staff, and students and instruct them that the American Urban Black Culture, which alanleroy suggests is a "terrible environment", is as valid as the White Culture. And to explicitly excuse what has formerly been seen as misbehavior, as an expression of Black Culture.

"Aaron Benner, a fourth-grade teacher who is black, and works in the Minnesota district also told EAG News that the training is actually holding back black children.
'As a black man I can say that they are hurting black kids,' Benner said. 'I’ve never seen anything as idiotic as PEG. Everything we do, PEG is at the forefront.'
'It’s so comical. PEG says shouting out in class is a black cultural norm, and being on time is a white cultural thing. It’s so demeaning, so condescending to black kids. If a white person were making claims like this, black people would be in an uproar.' Benner urged."
”Ref: allenbwest.com

DonDiego suspects time will demonstrate the success or failure of this exercise.
jatki
jatki
Jun 2, 2015
6:24am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: pjstroh
Quote
Originally posted by: Boilerman
Obama and Holder and other black leaders have taken a blatant anti-police stance. Others have followed as was seen with the Baltimore mayor. Police are concerned that if they take a tough stance against criminals, that politicians will not back them. In fact, some police believe that politicians will go after them legally, using them as pawns to gain votes and support from the black community. Anyone with half a brain saw this jump in crime coming.

As my mom used to say, the proof is in the pudding.



Boilerman vocablulary 101 "Anti police stance" : prosecuting cops accussed of murdering unarmed suspects.


---unless its a racist, white bigot in Nevada. Then its ok to blast law enforcement for even unholstering their guns:
Boilerman's anti-police rant about cops showing their guns at the Bundy Ranch
"I believe that I've seen one officer in my entire life pull his gun. This was at the Golden Nugget, interestingly enough.

The unusual thing at Bundy's ranch wasn't the fact that cops had guns, but the fact they they literally took an agressive stance. That they pulled and pointed their guns. That they implied potential deathly ramifications."



Again with the Bundy ranch bullshit? SHEESH.

As CLEARLY has been stated ,many on here foresaw a rise in crime because cops aren't going to engage as many people now for whatever reason one wants to choose. Obama and Holder policy? Believe the force won't back them up in case of any accusations are leveled against the individual? There's a myriad of reasons to choose from, whichever ones the cops are thinking, I don't know personally.

And nope, nobody ever said, implied or otherwise meant that "scumbag cops" can't shoot anyone now(or whatever you misquoted. Love it when you insert words/meanings/ideas as others. Makes for a really strong point of view.
jatki
jatki
Jun 2, 2015
6:33am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: DonDiego
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: hoops2
"Wait, are you really saying that schools that pick and choose the very best students with the most motivated parents actually get higher test scores??????"

As usual forky is wrong. Student at NYC charter schools are chosen by lottery. Anybody can apply & students are accepted covering the full range of aptitude.
And then they expel kids at double the rate of regular public schools. And they end up with better behaved students and, amazingly enough, higher test scores.
[No reference, . . .as usual - DD]

******quote***
Schools say suspensions maintain order, keep children safe, and allow teachers to focus on instruction by removing the most distracting students. Strict discipline has long been a cornerstone of the charter-school movement, and supporters argue that those policies have led to better academic outcomes for a majority of their students.
“Many families are flocking to charter schools, and one reason is that they believe in stricter discipline,” said Eva Moskowitz, founder and CEO of Success Academy, whose nine schools in 2011-12 suspended 17 percent of their students at least once. “Having some kids miss a day of instruction here and there for a suspension is far outweighed by the benefits of learning in an orderly environment all of the other days, as our academic results prove.”
***endquote***
Ref: ny.chalkbeat.org

Perhaps if the "regular public schools" expelled/suspended more violators their students would also demonstrate better behavior and higher test scores. Those not suspended would get a better education.
DonDiego, a suspension just means some kids miss a day of instruction here and there. But when students get EXPELLED from charter schools they are removed from their school forever (and probably shuttled back to a public school - resulting in lower test scores for them). Anyone who would conflate the two to win an internet argument is fundamentally dishonest.

So I think you should revise your post.


Forky's right, the troublemakers should be allowed to stay, why not. Who cares if it's at the expense of all the others there trying to actually learn and not raise hell.

jatki
jatki
Jun 2, 2015
6:41am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroy
That's why the inner-city poor children with little parental supervision need to go to boarding schools in the middle of New Mexico or Wyoming or far away from the inner-city....and when they are still young enough to fix. Then you aren't dealing with expulsions of gangsters or overcoming years of bad influences.....just forming the clay.

We're never going to really fix this unless those kids get out of that terrible environment. Some parents help their kids succeed in spite of the difficulties ...a few kids will learn regardless of the environment.....but a good percent of them are just trapped in a cycle of poverty with little chance of escape and a new lost generation of throwaways.

How about schools like the New Mexico Military Institute...only for K-12 and designed to address educating impoverished children? NMMI's annual price per student is a mere $11,732 and that Includes Tuition, Room, Board and Uniforms.

https://www.boardingschoolreview.com/school_ov/school_id/455

Something big has got to change to break the cycle. We just don't seem to be able to fix the parents or the public schools. The only answer is to change the kids....the best way to do that is to move them to a better place where they can really learn. It would take a generation, but it could be the last generation born into poverty.



I like the idea, can't think of a thing wrong with it. Taking kids out of the inner city, even for a few days can really open their eyes. I remember seeing on the news here a while back about a program that took bunches of kids out to some camp for a few days. Did all the usual outdoorsy kinds of things, horseback riding, fishing, the usual camp activities. They interviewed some of the kids and you'd think they had visited a different planet, it truly opened there eyes up that there's a whole other world out there, it seemed to make one heckuva impression on them.
jatki
jatki
Jun 2, 2015
6:47am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: DonDiego
Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroy
We're never going to really fix this unless those kids get out of that terrible environment. Some parents help their kids succeed in spite of the difficulties ...a few kids will learn regardless of the environment.....but a good percent of them are just trapped in a cycle of poverty with little chance of escape and a new lost generation of throwaways.

Unfortunately some cities are instating policies directly opposite to those recommended by the ever perceptive alanleroy.

The Minneapolis schools have contracted with a California organization entitled the Pacific Educational Group [PEG] to indoctrinate its school teachers and staff and students in something called "white privilege". The intent apparently is to shame the white teachers, staff, and students and instruct them that the American Urban Black Culture, which alanleroy suggests is a "terrible environment", is as valid as the White Culture. And to explicitly excuse what has formerly been seen as misbehavior, as an expression of Black Culture.

"Aaron Benner, a fourth-grade teacher who is black, and works in the Minnesota district also told EAG News that the training is actually holding back black children.
'As a black man I can say that they are hurting black kids,' Benner said. 'I’ve never seen anything as idiotic as PEG. Everything we do, PEG is at the forefront.'
'It’s so comical. PEG says shouting out in class is a black cultural norm, and being on time is a white cultural thing. It’s so demeaning, so condescending to black kids. If a white person were making claims like this, black people would be in an uproar.' Benner urged."
”Ref: allenbwest.com

DonDiego suspects time will demonstrate the success or failure of this exercise.


WOW. All I can say is..WOW. That almost seems like some kind of satirical piece somebody wrote. Being on time is a white cultural thing?? WOW So what is wearing one's pants properly pulled so their ass isn't hanging out called?

forkushV
forkushV
Jun 2, 2015
7:29am
Block User
Quote
Originally posted by: jatki99
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: DonDiego
Quote
Originally posted by: forkushV
Quote
Originally posted by: hoops2
"Wait, are you really saying that schools that pick and choose the very best students with the most motivated parents actually get higher test scores??????"

As usual forky is wrong. Student at NYC charter schools are chosen by lottery. Anybody can apply & students are accepted covering the full range of aptitude.
And then they expel kids at double the rate of regular public schools. And they end up with better behaved students and, amazingly enough, higher test scores.
[No reference, . . .as usual - DD]

******quote***
Schools say suspensions maintain order, keep children safe, and allow teachers to focus on instruction by removing the most distracting students. Strict discipline has long been a cornerstone of the charter-school movement, and supporters argue that those policies have led to better academic outcomes for a majority of their students.
“Many families are flocking to charter schools, and one reason is that they believe in stricter discipline,” said Eva Moskowitz, founder and CEO of Success Academy, whose nine schools in 2011-12 suspended 17 percent of their students at least once. “Having some kids miss a day of instruction here and there for a suspension is far outweighed by the benefits of learning in an orderly environment all of the other days, as our academic results prove.”
***endquote***
Ref: ny.chalkbeat.org

Perhaps if the "regular public schools" expelled/suspended more violators their students would also demonstrate better behavior and higher test scores. Those not suspended would get a better education.
DonDiego, a suspension just means some kids miss a day of instruction here and there. But when students get EXPELLED from charter schools they are removed from their school forever (and probably shuttled back to a public school - resulting in lower test scores for them). Anyone who would conflate the two to win an internet argument is fundamentally dishonest.

So I think you should revise your post.


Forky's right, the troublemakers should be allowed to stay, why not. Who cares if it's at the expense of all the others there trying to actually learn and not raise hell.
You're being dimmer than usual, which is saying a lot. My point was that expelling students is the charter school post facto way of picking and choosing the better students. Serving the same demographics, charter schools do worse than regular public schools.

Of course getting rid of weaker performers is not necessarily a bad thing, as long as it's done equitably. For example, in the 1990's when they got rid of of those losers, weaklings, and dim bulbs in our military, that improved our fighting forces considerably. (And that, jatki, is what you get for going all straw man on me.)
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