The Obama Internet

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Originally posted by: pjstroh
Not one person in opposition of net-neutrality on this thread can address the specific reason as to why. (Are we shocked?) They only offer abstract arguments about their ideology of government in the economy.

The specific question at hand is very simple. DO you believe your Internet Service Provider should be allowed to block, slow, or otherwise interfere with your desire to visit any legal, registered website of your choosing? This is a rhetorical question for anyone remotely interested in living in a consumer-empowered nation.

Our resident conservatives warn about the government determining where we can go on the internet. There is absolutely nothing in the proposed policy that constitutes that. Not one thing...but that's the strawman they point to - Something that's not even in the policy. Next thing you know they will be arguing against the death panels in Obamacare

By not having net-neutrality your ISP may determine where you go on the internet. I cant possibly imagine the argument to defend such control - especially from people who just got done complaining about having their access controlled. But then again, Obama is for net neutrality so that trumps everything.


The Obama administration said that it would not let the public see its 332 page net neutrality plan until after the FCC voted on its implementation. How can you make ANY claims about what it is or what it does?

I would add here I only have one choice. So it is take it or leave it, and that is the reality a lot of Americans have. Hell I am lucky as half the county I live in has 0 choices. That is there is no high speed internet at all. What internet those people have is limited to dial-up or 3G on a mobile network. To me it is much of a public utility as water, electric and natural gas.There are no choices or competition. That being the case it ought to be regulated just like a utility.

Oh and Alan the internet has already been largely corporatized and sanitized. 10 years ago the Internet was a wonderful place with various major search engines and small mom and pop style websites. Now it is largely a cesspool of corporate propaganda where you are only shown what Google or some other large corporation wants you to see.


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Originally posted by: pjstroh
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Originally posted by: DonDiego
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
Not one person in opposition of net-neutrality on this thread can address the specific reason as to why.
DonDiego proposes permitting free market forces to determine what services the providers provide and what services the users use and at what prices each is willing to provide such services and each is willing to purchase such services.
It is what markets do best, . . . and what bureaucrats do worst.


I live in a relatively large city and "the market" of high speed internet providers is 2 entities. Some areas only have one high speed provider. And some areas dont have any. bummer, huh.? especially if their isp decides to limit access.


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Originally posted by: BobOrme
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
Not one person in opposition of net-neutrality on this thread can address the specific reason as to why. (Are we shocked?) They only offer abstract arguments about their ideology of government in the economy.

The specific question at hand is very simple. DO you believe your Internet Service Provider should be allowed to block, slow, or otherwise interfere with your desire to visit any legal, registered website of your choosing? This is a rhetorical question for anyone remotely interested in living in a consumer-empowered nation.

Our resident conservatives warn about the government determining where we can go on the internet. There is absolutely nothing in the proposed policy that constitutes that. Not one thing...but that's the strawman they point to - Something that's not even in the policy. Next thing you know they will be arguing against the death panels in Obamacare

By not having net-neutrality your ISP may determine where you go on the internet. I cant possibly imagine the argument to defend such control - especially from people who just got done complaining about having their access controlled. But then again, Obama is for net neutrality so that trumps everything.


The Obama administration said that it would not let the public see its 332 page net neutrality plan until after the FCC voted on its implementation. How can you make ANY claims about what it is or what it does?
That's pretty much how regulatory agencies have done it during the ObamaBushClintonBushReaganCarterFordNixonJohnsonKennedyEisenhowerTrumanRoosevelt administrations. But you know me, always trying to blame it on Truman.
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
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Originally posted by: DonDiego
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
Not one person in opposition of net-neutrality on this thread can address the specific reason as to why.
DonDiego proposes permitting free market forces to determine what services the providers provide and what services the users use and at what prices each is willing to provide such services and each is willing to purchase such services.
It is what markets do best, . . . and what bureaucrats do worst.


I live in a relatively large city and "the market" of high speed internet providers is 2 entities. Some areas only have one high speed provider. And some areas dont have any. bummer, huh.? especially if their isp decides to limit access.

I would recommend that if PJ is unhappy with his high speed internet provider and if it is such a big thing in his life that he let his feet do the talking and move a location where he can get the ISP of his dreams. Now I like my ISP and Obama promised that if I like my ISP I can keep my ISP....or something like that.


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Originally posted by: alanleroy

I would recommend that if PJ is unhappy with his high speed internet provider and if it is such a big thing in his life that he let his feet do the talking and move a location where he can get the ISP of his dreams. Now I like my ISP and Obama promised that if I like my ISP I can keep my ISP....or something like that.


Lucky for me I wont have to move. We're getting net neutrality. What we're not getting is: a government telling us what sites we can visit, or a magically created and funded government agency, or any of the other false arguments you've made on this thread. Its nice to be in touch with reality. Life is much less scary.
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
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Originally posted by: alanleroy
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
The specific question at hand is very simple. DO you believe your Internet Service Provider should be allowed to block, slow, or otherwise interfere with your desire to visit any legal, registered website of your choosing? This is a rhetorical question for anyone remotely interested in living in a consumer-empowered nation.
.

If you don't like how you're being treated by your ISP then change your ISP. That's real consumer-empowerment. More regulations create barriers to entry and end up reducing consumer choice.

The real question isn't some simple new policy. It's whether the Federal Government should regulate another industry and create the corresponding bureaucracy that goes along with it. I'm very happy with my Internet thank you.


Ok, we can agree to disagree. You have massive reservations about the government determining what you have access to (even though thats not On the table) ..but You're cool with a corporation imposing the same restrictions (and that is on the table). Ok then.

More like I think the FCC should focus on getting rid of some it's 100,000+ pages of current onerous intrusions into American enterprise rather than inventing new ways to stifle commerce. As far as I know, no one here has ever complained about anything this new policy is allegedly fixing. No one I know has ever complained about it either. Access to high speed internet is not a human right. This is just a power grab.

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Originally posted by: forkushV
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Originally posted by: BobOrme
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Originally posted by: pjstroh
Not one person in opposition of net-neutrality on this thread can address the specific reason as to why. (Are we shocked?) They only offer abstract arguments about their ideology of government in the economy.

The specific question at hand is very simple. DO you believe your Internet Service Provider should be allowed to block, slow, or otherwise interfere with your desire to visit any legal, registered website of your choosing? This is a rhetorical question for anyone remotely interested in living in a consumer-empowered nation.

Our resident conservatives warn about the government determining where we can go on the internet. There is absolutely nothing in the proposed policy that constitutes that. Not one thing...but that's the strawman they point to - Something that's not even in the policy. Next thing you know they will be arguing against the death panels in Obamacare

By not having net-neutrality your ISP may determine where you go on the internet. I cant possibly imagine the argument to defend such control - especially from people who just got done complaining about having their access controlled. But then again, Obama is for net neutrality so that trumps everything.


The Obama administration said that it would not let the public see its 332 page net neutrality plan until after the FCC voted on its implementation. How can you make ANY claims about what it is or what it does?
That's pretty much how regulatory agencies have done it during the ObamaBushClintonBushReaganCarterFordNixonJohnsonKennedyEisenhowerTrumanRoosevelt administrations. But you know me, always trying to blame it on Truman.

So? That doesn't explain how anyone can claim what is or isn't in the plan. "There is absolutely nothing in the proposed policy that constitutes that. Not one thing...but that's the strawman they point to - Something that's not even in the policy."
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Originally posted by: pjstroh

What we're not getting is: a government telling us what sites we can visit

Not yet anyway. But look at what exactly the FCC does. It controls what you can see on broadcast television. It controls what you can hear on radio. It controls what can be done with Satellite and Cable. Once you've declared Internet Service Providers to require regulation as PUBLIC Utilities, it's not that far of a slip down the proverbial slope to start controlling some Internet content....in the public interest of course....really it isn't .

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Originally posted by: pjstroh
(What we're not getting is...) a magically created and funded government agency....

If PJ thinks the FCC newly regulating a multibillion dollar industry is not going to need any funding or new bureaucrats he has no concept about how Government really works.

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Originally posted by: alanleroy
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Originally posted by: pjstroh

What we're not getting is: a government telling us what sites we can visit

Not yet anyway. But look at what exactly the FCC does. It controls what you can see on broadcast television. It controls what you can hear on radio. It controls what can be done with Satellite and Cable. Once you've declared Internet Service Providers to require regulation as PUBLIC Utilities, it's not that far of a slip down the proverbial slope to start controlling some Internet content....in the public interest of course....really it isn't .

Quote

Originally posted by: pjstroh
(What we're not getting is...) a magically created and funded government agency....

If PJ thinks the FCC newly regulating a multibillion dollar industry is not going to need any funding or new bureaucrats he has no concept about how Government really works.


thats right ... the FCC doesn't allow corporations the freedom to show child pornagraphy on tv....or allow ISIS to air a recruitment infomercial....and now they will prevent your cable internet to interfer with your Netflx account.
Thanks for fucking up Alan's world, Obama.

I know how government works, Alan. Moreover i actually have the integrity to cite and discuss actual policy instead of making up fairy tales about the boogey man. Thats clearly a bridge to far for you. But, hey, its a NET-neutral world now. I support your right to post nonsnse on this board and i dont think your ISP should block it



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Originally posted by: alanleroy
As far as I know, no one here has ever complained about anything this new policy is allegedly fixing. No one I know has ever complained about it either. Access to high speed internet is not a human right. This is just a power grab.


What do yo mean you don't know anyone complaining? One corner of your mouth is arguing against a fictional, alternate universe where your internet freedom is infringed upon by the government. The other corner of your mouth is defending the power of corporations to infringe upon Your internet freedom.

Let us know what corner of your mouth wins.
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