Vegas Free-for-All - Obamacare Death Spiral

Obamacare Death Spiral

pjstroh

Aug 18, 2016
5:27am

Quote

Originally posted by: hoops2
Actually Aetna's 1st half EPs is flat to last year.

According to liberals, companies are not allowed to make money & if a business unit is losing money they are expected to hold onto to it. However it is the duty of the board of directors to make money for their stockholders & to shed money losing operations.

And if you think the top priority of any country's healthcare system is to make profit for private sector investors then you belong to the right party, Hoops.

jphelan

Aug 18, 2016
6:00am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: billryan
Balance a checkbook?
My, you really are living in the past. Who even writes checks these days?

When I went to high school, Consumer Economics was a required class for graduation. Today, most states don't even require any basic financial education. No wonder nearly 98% of today's college student do not know if their loans accumulate interest in-school or during deferment.

Todays Students Shortchanged

College Students clueless about student loans

alanleroyII

Aug 18, 2016
6:18am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: pjstroh

Quote
Originally posted by: hoops2
Actually Aetna's 1st half EPs is flat to last year.

According to liberals, companies are not allowed to make money & if a business unit is losing money they are expected to hold onto to it. However it is the duty of the board of directors to make money for their stockholders & to shed money losing operations.

And if you think the top priority of any country's healthcare system is to make profit for private sector investors then you belong to the right party, Hoops.

The Democrats signature legislation in the last 8 years....an overhaul of healthcare in America...is firmly rooted in private insurance. When those private insurers start dropping out of the program like dead flies, it's time to take a step back and try to fix it.

That ain't going to happen...Because the Republicans don't want to lose the ACA as an issue and the Democrats don't want to admit there's a problem. Unfortunately that means these issues just continue to build up until it explodes. Same thing with the debt.

billryan

Aug 18, 2016
6:19am

Block User

Perhaps we should turn public safety over to for profit businesses, like it used to be. No more single payer option.
If a Police department can't show a profit in a given neighborhood, move out.

alanleroyII

Aug 18, 2016
6:24am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: billryan
Perhaps we should turn public safety over to for profit businesses, like it used to be. No more single payer option.
If a Police department can't show a profit in a given neighborhood, move out.

So..are you admitting the ACA is a failure and it's time to move on to something else? Maybe the Democrats should have thought of that before they passed the bill they never read. And if the issue is 'profit', why have 16 of the 23 not for profit healthcare co-ops failed...leaving taxpayers on the hook for a billion+?

malibber2

Aug 18, 2016
6:41am

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Quote

Originally posted by: alanleroyII

Quote
Originally posted by: billryan
Perhaps we should turn public safety over to for profit businesses, like it used to be. No more single payer option.
If a Police department can't show a profit in a given neighborhood, move out.

Alan you make a good point. The part of Obamacare that is failing is the for profit part. (The co-ops had to make a profit or at least break even in order to continue to do business.) Obamacare is a proof of concept. Namely, there is no way to make people that live in rural areas, people that have preexisting conditions or are too old profitable for an insurance company. What is the solution given that?

alanleroyII

Aug 18, 2016
7:15am

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Quote

Originally posted by: malibber2

Quote
Originally posted by: alanleroyII
Quote
Originally posted by: billryan
Perhaps we should turn public safety over to for profit businesses, like it used to be. No more single payer option.
If a Police department can't show a profit in a given neighborhood, move out.
So..are you admitting the ACA is a failure and it's time to move on to something else? Maybe the Democrats should have thought of that before they passed the bill they never read. And if the issue is 'profit', why have 16 of the 23 not for profit healthcare co-ops failed...leaving taxpayers on the hook for a billion+?

Alan you make a good point. The part of Obamacare that is failing is the for profit part. Obamacare is a proof of concept. Namely, there is no way to make people that live in rural areas, have preexisting conditions or are too old profitable for an insurance company. What is the solution given that?

Well if it is the 'for profit part' that's failing, why have most of the Non Profit Co-Ops failed miserably too?

But to your question, I have a whole host of ways we could take probably half the costs out of our healthcare system with the same level of patient care. I can't go into all of them now, but trust me on that. I see that as the biggest failing of the ACA. It was cooked up by the bureaucrats, the AMA, Big Pharma and the Insurance Lobby. It never seriously addressed costs....That's why a knee replacement still costs 50K in the US and 5K in Belgium. Or why we can't get prescriptions from Canada over the internet. Or why we still spend 40% of our Medical expenses keeping human vegetables hooked up in ICU for their last 60 miserable days....but I digress.

On the insurance side you could do the following:

1. Require any company in the health insurance business that offers group policies or supplemental Medicare insurance to also offer individual policies. Or maybe not have Group policies at all....only individual. That prevents cherry picking only the healthiest and better spreads the costs among everyone.

2. Have national certification and standards that allows certified national insurers to offer coverage in any state....without falling subject to the 50 state insurance regulation rackets.

3. Medicare as an insurer of last resort for certain chronic conditions.

4. I would consider a public option too. But it would be in competition with private insurance and not receive any subsidies or considerations that a private (for profit or non-profit) insurer could not receive.

jatki

Aug 18, 2016
8:12am

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Quote

Originally posted by: JM2300

Quote
Originally posted by: billryan
Balance a checkbook?
My, you really are living in the past. Who even writes checks these days?

So no one writes checks anymore? We learned it here folks.

Really? The crack whore on the corner still takes checks (well that's what I heard anyway).

jatki

Aug 18, 2016
8:24am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: pjstroh
Aetna's EPS has gone up every year since 2012 and is on pace for even higher this year. So lets put the BS about "Aetna losing money" to bed.

Poor Aetna only keeps earning more and more.

But it is true that Aetna (and every health insurer in the country) loses money on sick people and makes money on healthy people. Insurance companies would love nothing more than to only offer insurance to people who don't need it - which was the fundamental problem with preObamacare and to some extant postObamacare.

Raise your hand if you think insurance companies should be allowed to offer their service only to people who don't need it.

I hope someday Republicans can get past their desire to stick it to Obama and try to actually solve some of the problems with our healthcare system. There's still a lot of work to do.

I'll raise my hand (somewhat) but that's in the land of rinbows and lollipops. If a division of any corp./business is losing more than a quarter billion a year, it's going to get shut down. Would I like to see the sick retain there health insurance, sure I would but as a businessman, I would have to shut it down.

Would you invest in a company that had such losses PJ? I doubt it, I know I wouldn't.

IndyBoilerman

Aug 18, 2016
9:12am

Block User

Quote

Originally posted by: pjstroh

Quote
Originally posted by: hoops2
Actually Aetna's 1st half EPs is flat to last year.

According to liberals, companies are not allowed to make money & if a business unit is losing money they are expected to hold onto to it. However it is the duty of the board of directors to make money for their stockholders & to shed money losing operations.

And if you think the top priority of any country's healthcare system is to make profit for private sector investors then you belong to the right party, Hoops.

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