Voter IDs

We agree. Any voter fraud is unacceptable and should be investigated and punished. Where we disagree is that you seem to be willing to disenfranchise thousands in order to prevent the possibility. Isn't that the opposite of the very bedrock of our democracy? Everyone is innocent until found guilty? Isn't it better that a dozen guilty men go free than one innocent is punished? Maybe those are just words to some, they are a guiding principle to me.
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Originally posted by: jphelan
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Originally posted by: friedmush
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Originally posted by: jphelan
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Originally posted by: friedmush
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Originally posted by: jphelan
I'm glad voterID is not necessary.

Wouldn't it prevent the dead from voting?

Dead Vote in Chicago

And it Ain't Just Happening in Chicago

Why not just show your drivers license, passport, OR social security card? The social security numbers should be validated against a database to eliminate the dead voters.


You might consider linking to stories that support your position. From you second link:

"It’s true that she committed voter fraud. But it’s also true that she was caught, charged, and punished for it. These aren’t the days of ballot box stuffing, and while errors do occur, significant discrepancies are typically spotted and acted upon. Perhaps, even more importantly, she was charged with 19 counts over a series of elections between 2009 and 2012, in which she placed one or two extra votes in Bridgeport Town Council elections, a city of some 150,000 people. It is exceedingly unlikely that her extra votes had any impact whatsoever.

Conversely, according to a report from the Brennan Center for Justice, up to 11 percent of voters could be rendered unable to vote by voter ID laws. A restriction that, unlike one or two extra votes, could have a significant impact on elections, and one that demonstrably impacts poor people and minorities very disproportionately.

Of course, all of this ignores one other important fact. Ayala’s voter fraud could not have been prevented by a voter ID law.

Ayala executed her crime by voting in elections in districts where she was registered as living, but did not actually live, something that presenting ID would do nothing to prevent.

Voter fraud does exist and does happen, and nobody denies that. But it is so rare as to be statistically nonexistent, and the few fraudulent votes that are placed have in all probability never changed the results of a single election. This is something that can’t be said of voter ID laws, which many proponents admit. Politicians who have fought to enact strict voter ID laws have repeatedly stated on record that they believe them to have impacted the 2008 Presidential election results.

So, while the story now being circulated is true, it’s not only out of date, but it draws conclusions that simply can’t be rationally drawn from the example. If anything, the story of Christina Ayala and her 19 counts of voter fraud demonstrate that it’s simply not a problem we need to worry about.

Read more at https://www.inquisitr.com/3557550/democrat-christina-ayala-did-commit-19-counts-of-voter-fraud-but-its-not-new-and-its-not-common/#taiYD7Ef6cxWJSte.99"

^ From your post.


So someone got caught illegaly voting 19 times and this is "not evidence" of voter fraud. ANY voter fraud is unacceptable and it is amazing how much is uncovered when people crunch the numbers by cross referencing voters to list of dead people. We should cross reference duplicate names in different precincts / states because people move all the time.

Require a social security number to vote - everyone has one and there is no charge. Then it is easy to cross reference SSN's for duplicate votes and dead people. How could any sane American oppose this simple reform?


Why are you debating me? You are the one who posted to this information. Shouldn't you be debating yourself?

That was my point that if you are going to link supporting information, you might consider linking to information that supports your belief.


You just don't get it do you? ANY voter fraud is unacceptable. ANY voter fraud the goes unprosecuted will only cause more ---- kinda like illegal immigration. INVESTIGATE suspected fraud and Prosecute it aggressively. USE DATA ANALYTICS to detect irregularities (like dead folks voting and people voting more than once). ENFORCE the laws.


This is pure comedy.

I am not debating any of these issues. I'm pointing out that if you want to make a point and support your position by providing links you should make sure your links actually support your position and don't counter the argument you are trying to make. High School Speech and Debate 101


Democrats told us that we could keep our doctor. Democrats told us that Hillary didn't transmit classified information from her home computer. Democrats told us that Hillary didn't lie.

Now you want us to believe you when you tell us that a dozen folks vote illegally? I think not. Once a liar, always a liar.


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Originally posted by: billryan
We agree. Any voter fraud is unacceptable and should be investigated and punished. Where we disagree is that you seem to be willing to disenfranchise thousands in order to prevent the possibility. Isn't that the opposite of the very bedrock of our democracy? Everyone is innocent until found guilty? Isn't it better that a dozen guilty men go free than one innocent is punished? Maybe those are just words to some, they are a guiding principle to me.


I imagine many a Democratic teacher told you you were Special.
In that case, at least, we were honest.
As for the rest of your rant, I have no clue what you are talking about and obviously neither do you.

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Originally posted by: billryan
Aren't the people behind those videos the same ones who submitted the heavily edited videos of Planned Parenthood? When the unedited videos were shown, didn't it pretty much show the polar opposite of the edited ones?
Fool me once, same on you. Fool me twice, shame on me.


I would be just as interested as you in seeing the entire unedited videos. The immediate disconnect from the guys by the DNC tells a little something tho, maybe tells A LOT, maybe nothing at all. Seeing the unedited vids would definitely resolve the issue. I would hate to think either party was as slimy as portrayed in them.
We didn't have that touchy feely, Liberal bullshit going on in the top notch public schools that I attended. Our teachers praised the good kids and paddled the bad. It worked.


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Originally posted by: billryan
I imagine many a Democratic teacher told you you were Special.
In that case, at least, we were honest.
As for the rest of your rant, I have no clue what you are talking about and obviously neither do you.


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Originally posted by: billryan
We agree. Any voter fraud is unacceptable and should be investigated and punished. Where we disagree is that you seem to be willing to disenfranchise thousands in order to prevent the possibility. Isn't that the opposite of the very bedrock of our democracy? Everyone is innocent until found guilty? Isn't it better that a dozen guilty men go free than one innocent is punished? Maybe those are just words to some, they are a guiding principle to me.


As I said, I don't think there are as many disenfranchised as some claim there to be. Anyone who cared that much about voting would (should) have obtained something by now. I do think the sancity of voting is an extremely important issue for this country, and I don't think acquiring an ID isn't nearly as prohibitive as people like forky make it sound. Too many bus rides and such? Hogwash, how do they get around now? I'd bet anything if anyone was actually having that much trouble getting an ID a call the local party HQ and theyw ould assist in anyway they could, they already do huge registration drives not to mention rent vans for people like forky. Why not help them forever?

The whole "guilty dozen men.." analogy doesn't jibe at all either, not talking about a crfime here ,so yes, I think the sanctity of legal voting supercedes the few too lazy or whatever to go by the rules. I would rather see one lazy/apathetic voter not being able to vote than a dozen illegal votes, wouldn't you agree? There is ABSOLUTELY no reason whatsoever that every person shouldn't own some sort of identification to show who they are, NONE.
Just something to consider

You need an ID to:

Vote
buy a gun
to fly on a plane
to go into a government building
to apply for social security benefits
to apply for food stamps/welfare/unemployment benefits
to drive
to purchase car insurance
to buy alcohol
to buy cigaretts
to get a credit card
to open a checking/savings account
to verify idenity for a job (I9)
Most importantly, to obtain a casino club card.

just some of the things you need an state issued ID for.
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Originally posted by: chefantwon
Just something to consider

You need an ID to:

Vote
buy a gun
to fly on a plane
to go into a government building
to apply for social security benefits
to apply for food stamps/welfare/unemployment benefits
to drive
to purchase car insurance
to buy alcohol
to buy cigaretts
to get a credit card
to open a checking/savings account
to verify idenity for a job (I9)
Most importantly, to obtain a casino club card.

just some of the things you need an state issued ID for.
Apply for Social Security Benefits? Nope. Buy alcohol for most adults? Nope. Buy cigarettes or most adults? Nope? To get into all government buildings? Nope. Apply for a credit card? Nope.

And I bet I didn't catch all of them. So chef, where did you get this list. I think we should all know to avoid such a disreputable source, don't you agree?
Why are liberals so concerned about putting in a process such as legal id or fingerprints that would insure that all votes cast are legal?
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