Question of the Day - 02 July 2023

It's so obvious that if any major casino turned back the clock to say, 2005--3/2 BJ, free parking, no resort fees, good VP and slots, good players' club, low room rates, easy comps, etc. etc., that place would be absolutely mobbed. Look how busy South Point is, for example (and it's not all that much of a bargain destination; it just outdoes all the gouge joints).

This is such an obvious approach for SOMEONE to take, I have to attribute its failing to happen to some serious arm-twisting. I suspect that anybody who floats the idea of opening a "bargain joint" is dissuaded in ways subtle and unsubtle, legal and, um, extra-legal.

Keeping everything short-staffed is a major blunder. All the reviews and comments I've read over the last couple of years suggest that nothing rankles and sticks in the customer's memory more than shitty service. $25 6:5 BJ is one thing. Spending your vacation time endlessly waiting in lines is another.

Here is a different thought.

We have a debt based economy that started decades ago when credit was allowed for purchases.
People who are in debt have become slaves to that debt, you have to keep earning to support the debt.

I think many are becoming more aware of this slavery and turning to savings rather than debt.
Now that debt doesn't enslave them anymore, they feel free to spend wantonly with abandon.

On the other hand, some just don't care how much debt they run up.

In either case, people run out of money, and when they do, Vegas will do anything to get them back.

After all, all of this spending has only been going on for a year or two and will end within five years.
First, profits start to decline, then little come ons will appear, then profits start dropping like a landslide, the strip panics and all the old goodies return to Vegas, and locals return to the casinos.

Jackie, I hope you are correct and things begin to change back in 5 years or less. But it appears that gamblers are being relegated to the back of the Vegas bus in favor of shoppers, show viewers and fine diners who, I think, are more amenable to be gouged than the intelligent gambler (as opposed to the ignorant gambler who blissfully throws his money into the fire of 6-5 $25 shufflemaster tables). Since the grand reopening in 2021, my friends and I have foregone our annual Vegas trip in favor of Biloxi, MS. The weather is delightful in February, the Mardi Gras celebration is a hoot, the people welcome us and the gambling, particularly in the locals joints, vastly exceeds the offerings on the strip and downtown. I encourage others to vote with their feet until the suits in the executive suites notice that we have gone elsewhere.

I just got back from Vegas, where I shelled out $60 for a burger, fries, soft drink, and dessert (at Gordon Ramsay Burger). Most people who pay that sort of money either (a) aren't there for the gambling, (b) don't care how bad 6-5 blackjack or triple-zero roulette are, or (c) are convinved they can make it all back in one of two ways; either with their "card-counting skills" or "this new betting method I've learned: bet $25 on red, then if you lose, keep doubling the bet - red will eventually win, and when it does, you're $25 ahead from when you started."

I'll chime in agreeing with all commenters so far. We can lament "the good old days" 'til the cows come home but that won't change a thing. Our Florida casinos are just as bad. Tighter than the bark on a tree. We can take 3 days, drive to Biloxi (1000 mile round trip), get a comped room for 2 nights, a decent food credit (covers one night dinner), and spend less overall than we will in one afternoon in Tampa. Vegas since mid 80's, particularly for WNFR (which we love) but we're done.

Good answer and comments and here's another thought. They say that for this rare four-day weekend 350,000 visitors are expected. Talk about a gouge within the gouge! Yes, the laws of supply and demand have always held true everywhere, but I can't help wondering who in their right mind would put up with the jacked up prices, ferocious crowds, merciless traffic (back and forth from So. Cal AND on the Strip from the F1 repaving), and unavoidably grim service (on a good day)? It boggles the imagination. 

Those who are gifting the LV casinos nowadays....who are they?  Are they the folks who miss the good old days or younger folks who never experienced the good old days?  There weren't players clubs on 3/2/83, they came maybe 7 or 8 years later. But I started going to LV in 1979 and yes, I could get a flight and room for 4 nights with Mr. Travel in Chicago costing only $250. Then my daily gambling allotment of $50 was close to enough, with food and miscellaneous not costing much more. I wonder if they've studied the age group of the current visitors to LV. Specifically, the age group of the gamblers, diners, shoppers, sun worshipers, entertainment goers, etc. It might answer some questions. If you never experienced it, you won't miss it.

Disregard to service, Higher and Higher prices, not so "Hidden" Fees, No free parking, way too expensive food and drink prices, they all add up, It's all been growing like a great big snow ball, It seems Unions are not doing enough for Hotel employees either, grossly understaffed Hotels and Casinos make for pitiful service, so who wins? in the short run, Hotel-Casino owners and their investors, yup, the guys (and gals)who only care about money earnings. Places like South Point, Gold Coast, the Orleans are taking advantage, and then there are places like Excalibur, Luxor, Circus-circus, why are they full?, there's a need for them, they get packed, they are budget friendly, and the owners don't even do that much to make them more appealing, no need to. Change is coming, when?, when we start feeling the pain of overspending, it will happen, it may take some time, but it will happen.meanwhile South point, Orleans, Excalibur, circus-circus, luxor, here we come!  

We go most years during the slowest week of the year, right after NFR in December. We stay at the Nugget, gamble at Four Queens and the El. No, it is not like it was, but downtown still offers plenty of value. I park free. The LVA coupons, while not as generous this year, still offer some good advantage plays. We have even generated free room offers for 4Q and the El over the past year--first time in years we've gotten offered anything. Cars are still cheap if you know the right codes, locals joints have amazing food at fair prices, and the gambling at the El and 4Q is as good as ever. 

Have any of you been to the gazillion casinos outside of Vegas? It's no better. In the "good old days" Vegas sucked in the gamblers who thought they could beat them. Now they don't have to. It's still a better "destination" than the stay near to home places around the country. And, as has been pointed out, the younger crowd doesn't even know about the "good old days". People, Vegas doesn't need you anymore. They have new customers and we olt-timers are all dying out. If you don't go, they don't care.

Unfortunately I maybe a little negative in my assessment but here goes. Corporations are built for profits thus greed in many ways. I believe one of the first companies to prove this was Disney it showed how never ending cost increases for sought after entertainment is an excepted policy.This shows MGM the business plan “no competition works” Then with the political policy of Democrats hating Republicans and visa versa people need a release and pay whatever. Ca you really blame corporations for this mentality?

I live in Pennsylvania.  I can visit my local casino where they are required by law to pay 3:2 on blackjacks and stay on all 17s.  Unfortunately however the VP machines all have crappy pay tables.

While the casinos in Nevada have had record earnings recently, I've been told while that is correct nominatively, it isn't correct if you adjust for inflation.  That would have been the middle of the 00s (2005-2006) before the casinos got super greedy.

The mistake is to assume it's all about gambling in Las Vegas for people. It's not. Far from it. I think most people go there for other things, food, atmosphere, concerts, clubs, bars, hang out. Sure, some gamble, but this QOD assumes that's the primary reason people go to Las Vegas and it's not true at all based on data I've seen and watching what people do there. Prices? People obviously willing to pay it. For us, we get a 5 diamond stay for less than a chain mid range hotel. There's smart ways to stay cheap at nice resorts, like matching hotel reward cards to Las Vegas chains. We've done it for years. We gamble a very small amount on VP sometimes, sometimes not, but have a nice time staying in very nice rooms. Hanging out, walking around, taking in the atmosphere. For those who want to bet the rent money & more & think they are still getting 'value' & 'handouts', sounds like that's not there anymore. Probably good for your net worth frankly, invest instead? Play VP on your phone? 

Before I begin.. John, PLEASE share some car rental codes!

When I first started coming to Vegas I stayed downtown. Free. Then I moved to the Strip and stayed there.. for free.. Then came resort fees and I moved off strip such as Orleans and Palace Station.. again for free because they don't charge resort fees with comped rooms. Then came sky high car rentals so after Covid I went back downtown where you can visit several casinos... and you guessed it.. free room offers followed. I can stay 3 nights at Plaza, 3 nights at Nugget and 3 nights at GGate or D, Fremont or El Cortez.. All for free. I would call myself a moderate slot and Blackjack player. I'm no whale but I guess I play enough to get these offers. I visit in March and September. 
With all they hype LVA is giving the Grand these days I'm going to play some there and see what offers come. Granted the food and free play offers all of them send pretty much suck but I really appreciated being able to still not pay for a hotel room

We used to go to Vegas three times a year.  Have not been there since the pandemic and don't miss it at all.  No fun being ripped off!

You can do LV at far lower prices if you put in a little work.  See what the Web sites for your various players' "reward" programs will give you.  Buy the LVA rewards book and use the coupons.  If you're played a decent amount at your hotel, politely ask about comp meals.  Watch a lot of videos and patronize the good-but-not-expensive restaurants.  Take in some less expensive shows.

I'll be darned if I'll play poor payout video poker or 6:5 blackjack.  I give my business to the places that don't "give me the business".  I buy my show tickets at the discount booths on the day of the show.

One example--Each trip, I stay at two or three hotels, all comped.  Some even waive the "resort fee".  I have to piece things together, I have to wait in lines at each (sometimes checking my bags and coming back after dinner to check in, when lines are shorter), but I save money and stay at decent places. That includes a night or two downtown each trip, a total value play. 

Vegas has always been my happy place for vacationing over the last 20 years, and 6-8 times a year was not out of the question but since covid and the loss of all my players perks that the casinos seem to not care about any more and player retention, I have only gone once in the last 4 years. My last mission was to use up all points and cash out points wherever I could. Boyd, Stations and a few others are dead to me and I no longer support any of these properties and really have zero interest in paying resort fees, parking fees, or the let's see how far we can screw you fees. I'm not stupid enough to support the blatant gauging of consumers. I'm not even interested in all the sporting events and new stadiums. Could care less. So I will gladly take the money I spent on gambling, hotels, food and car rentals and spend it elsewhere. I hope Vegas gets it's head out of it's ass and smartens up, but that is highly unlikely.

OF LBJ's SIGNING THE CIVIL RIGHTS ACT OF 1964 DESPITE THE BEST EFFORTS OF SOUTHERN POLITICIANS TO KEEP BLACK AMERICANS UNDER THEIR FEET... A GREAT DAY FOR ALL TRUE AMERICANS.

The question assumes there is a huge world of alternatives out there.  There isn't.  The question is about at bright as "When are people going to wise up an not go to to Disney World/Land anymore?

I don't do Vegas as often anymore. As for Station Casino's I have not stepped inside any of them once they did not reopen their buffets. Used to spend most of my time there while in town.

My trips to Vegas have gone from three or four a year to one. The good part is my spending has also dropped. Unfortunately the suits have taken over. Lousy table minimums, no (or very few) buffets, sporadic drink service while playing and over all surly service is the new Vegas. AS long as people continue to accept this it will not change. Hopefully, the free money that people collected over the last three years or didn't spend or go on vacation will soon right itself and there will be a come to home reckoning. Otherwise we are stuck with remembering when a trip to Vegas was something to look forward to with great anticipation. In the meantime off strip is the answer with casinos like Southpoint still player friendly.

Just can't fathom the NV Leg passed a law about daily house keeping. Just Unreal. When we go on vakay I expect just a bit of daily service. Neat up the bed, trash, towels, etc. I leave a 10 spot to boot.Brilliant. Let's put some people out of work. Goodness...SKM

We come 2 to 3 times a year. Used to stay at the Trop we now stay downtown, last 15 years. Gone from  Fritzgerald's (the D)to loud. to Boyd for 10 years . Now the Plaza , nicer rooms and no overpowering noise from Freemont St. and better comps.
Free parking when we drive from KC.

My understanding is that nothings changed, just reversing out covid useless nonsense rules:

'Pandemic-era daily hotel room cleanings are no longer required in Nevada. That's after Governor Joe Lombardo signed Senate Bill 441 into law this week.

During the pandemic, state lawmakers passed Senate Bill 4, which outlined cleaning standards. S.B. 441 would repeal Senate Bill 4 and cleaning standards would return to the way they were prior to the pandemic.'

yell at the hotel, not the bill that passed that just made things back the way they were. btw, doesn't take bills either to change cleaning standards by hotels. With zero exceptions, no matter the hotel or chain we stay at, daily room cleaning is a dodo bird. Frankly, complete waste of time, resources, and beyond imho.