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When to Hold a Kicker in Double Double Bonus Progressive

Competent Double Double Bonus players know that from a hand like A♠ A♥ A♣ 4♦ 7♠, the correct play is AAA and not AAA4. Players might be tempted to hold AAA4 because four aces with a 2, 3, or 4 (a kicker) in this game receive 2,000 coins and four aces with any other fifth card “only” receive 800 coins.

Sometimes, however, there are one or more progressives on this game. If there is only one progressive, it’s usually on the royal flush. The second progressive goes on four aces with a kicker (AWAK). There can also be progressives on aces without a kicker, and sometimes other hands as well.

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How Would You Do It?

On the videopoker.com forum, a player recently wrote about coming across a quarter Five Play Super Times Play machine that consistently had a 5x multiplier. Every hand. He milked it for 45 minutes or so for almost $4,000 and left — happy to get away undetected. 

Let’s say, however, that you want to milk the machine as long as it lasts. How would you go about doing it? 

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Checking the Meter

I’ve found a bank of four machines where sometimes the progressives are playable. I’m intentionally changing the details a bit because I wish to instruct players but not give away the exact location of the play.

As is my wont, every time I think the progressive is high enough and I’m the only player (which is a common occurrence for graveyard players but not so common for daytime players), I check the meters. For a machine with one or more progressives, I write down the amounts, $20 through the machine, and then I see how much the meters has changed. If it’s a 1% meter, the sum of the meters will have gone up 20¢. If it’s a half-percent meter, 10¢.

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You Want Me to Play to Lose $100?

I was playing 25¢ Five Play 9/6 Jacks or Better Multi Strike at the South Point during their “Half Price Amazon Gift Cards” promotion in November. A friend, “George”, sat down next to me. And later still his wife joined us.

I didn’t notice how much George put in to start. Early on he hit a $1,000 royal flush on the bottom line and then later a $250 four-of-a-kind on an 8x line.

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Multiple Drawing Entries

There are many casinos with promotions where the player can earn extra drawing tickets during certain periods, such as 5x tickets during 4 p.m. to 6 p.m. on Fridays, or perhaps 10x tickets all day Tuesday. 

To the player, whether 5x drawing tickets is worth more or less than 2x points depends on the value of each. You can usually figure out exactly how much 2x points is worth and it will always be an estimate of how much 5x drawing tickets is worth. 

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Dealing with Money

I recently received an email from a slot director with whom I’m friendly. It read: 

I’ve had a number of customers ask me what banks in Las Vegas are gambler friendly, meaning they understand how “professional gambler” is an actual profession and as such, banks would be used to multiple deposits, withdrawals etc. in varying amounts and timing.

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I’ve Heard This One Before

In my classes, I often get out-of-town students. Whether I am teaching Quick Quads, Ultimate X, Deuces Wild, or whatever, there are often students who decided long ago that they are going to take at least one Bob Dancer class — and this is the week they’re in Vegas.

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Which is Better — W2G or Not?

The Las Vegas Advisor has a Question of the Day. These are questions sent in by readers where a bite-sized answer is sufficient. Sometimes when it’s about video poker, the LVA passes it on to me. They recently sent me a question which is printed below. While the answer isn’t difficult, there are a lot of things to discuss — depending on how advanced the reader is. Since it was more blog-length rather than QOD-length, I decided to answer the question here.

It begins with the question:
I go to my local riverboat casino and play bonus poker video poker.  I do not play professional so I would have to pay any W2G that I would get. My question is if I include a 30% tax on the royal flush payout at the dollar machine ($4,000 royal), am I better off playing a 99.17% pay dollar machine or a 96.87% quarter machine where the royals will not be taxed. I would think you need to take the percent of the 99.17% that is the royal payout and multiply that by .7 and add it back in to see if it is better than the 96.87%. Is that correct and what is the percent of the 99.17% that is the royal payout?

For those of you who aren’t familiar with Bonus Poker payouts, the 99.17% version pays 40 for the full house and the 96.87% version pays 30 for the full house. The games are otherwise identical and the correct strategies for both games are essentially identical.

Most video poker software products will tell you that you’ll get a royal flush on Bonus Poker every 40,233 hands. To make this simpler to work with, I’m going to assume this number is exactly 40,000. It will not affect the conclusion.

Playing for dollars, every 40,000 hands (which means $200,000 coin-in) you have to pay $1,200 in taxes (which is 30% of $4,000) which I can treat differently because I file as a professional. If you divide $1,200 by $200,000, you come up with 0.6%. This makes the post-tax 8/5 Bonus Poker worth 98.57%, which is quite a bit higher than 96.87%.

So, obviously, since 98.57% is better than 96.87%, that proves playing for dollars and paying the taxes is the better play. Except there are more things to consider.

First of all, are you playing the same number of hands or the same amount in dollars? It takes the same amount of time to play $50,000 at quarters as it does to play $200,000 at dollars. Your expected loss at dollars is 0.0143 * $200,000 (which equals $2,860) while playing $50,000 at quarters will cost you 0.0313 * $50,000 (which equals $1,565).

Looked at this way, playing quarters is the “better” (meaning “less bad”) play.
(Is it impossibly rude to suggest that staying out of that casino is better than either of these plays?)

We haven’t discussed the slot club. Do you get money in the mail? Do you earn free play from your points? It’s possible that dollars could still be the cheaper play. Without discussing the slot club benefits, it’s impossible to make a final determination.

Another possibility is to play quarter single coins! Playing one quarter at a time is only worth 95.6329%, but in same time it takes you to play $200,000 at dollars or $50,000 at max-coin quarters, you’re only risking $10,000 at single-line quarters. That will make your expected loss $437, which is considerably “less bad” than either of the previous two expected losses.

Playing single coin, however, on those rare occasions you hit the royal flush, you’ll collect a lousy $62.50 instead of the $1,000 you’d get from a max-coin quarter royal, or $250 instead of the $2,800 you’d get from the after-tax max-coin dollar royal. If somebody sees what you did, they’ll tell you what an idiot you are for not betting max-coin and collecting the full royal. Never mind that your move makes financial sense. For some people, they’ll feel so bad at missing out on the max-coin royal that they are in misery, even though they just hit a royal flush.

I tell you, playing single coin isn’t for the weak at heart!

So, looking at these options, how would I boil it down to one choice? That is, what would I do were I to face these exact circumstances?

My answer is simple. I wouldn’t play at all. If the slot club doesn’t pay enough to make up for the shortfalls we’ve listed here, I’m not even frequenting this casino. Going into a casino knowing I can’t be a long-term winner is against my religion.

Author’s note: The basic premise of this QOD and the answer is seriously flawed, but I chose to answer it as given anyway. All gambling revenue is legally taxable — whether you get a W2G or not. The idea that you don’t owe taxes unless individual jackpots are $1,200 or higher is completely incorrect. If any of this is foreign to you, listen to the August 29 Gambling with an Edge podcast where Richard Munchkin and I interview tax expert Russell Fox.

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What Would You Do?

In the 1970s, I was a backgammon player in Los Angeles. Decent enough player, but not great.

One of the semi-regular players at the Cavendish West was a guy named Steve. Steve was a so-so intermediate player — but he cheated. After a while, word got out and he couldn’t get into a game because his reputation preceded him.

I didn’t mind him as a person, although I would never gamble with him nor ever enter into a deal with him where he had a chance to screw me. Our respective girl friends liked each other and sometimes we went out as a foursome. I always insisted on him giving me $100 before we went out to cover his half of the meal. I would return any amount left over. No $100 beforehand meant no double date.

In January 1977, we visited a restaurant that I liked and Steve had never visited. It was a week before the Oakland Raiders versus Minnesota Vikings Superbowl XI. Since the game was being held in nearby Pasadena, there was a lot of local interest and the owner/cook, Jack, had the restaurant decorated in silver and black — signifying he liked the Oakland Raiders in that game.

Steve saw an opportunity. He was quite a charming guy — until it became time to pay up. He chatted up Jack and before too long they made a bet for “double or nothing for the next meal Steve ate” based on the results of the upcoming game.

Although the bet sounded fair, knowing Steve, it clearly wasn’t. If the Vikings won, Steve would bring three guests and order up lobster tails all around with several bottles of expensive wine. If the Raiders won (which actually turned out to be the case), Steve would disappear. He would never be around to pay off the bet.

By accepting the bet, Jack put himself into a position where he couldn’t win, but he could lose big-time. 

My personal philosophy on bets between two other people is to stay out of it unless a family member was taking the worst of it. Whatever the two of them arranged was fine. Even if I thought one of them was taking the worst of it, I kept my mouth shut.

And that’s what I did here — with great misgivings.

While I didn’t know Jack well, I had been there for dinner three or four times and we greeted each other by first names. He didn’t know Steve was a sleazeball, but I did. Did he have a reasonable expectation that I wouldn’t bring someone dishonorable into his restaurant? I wasn’t sure, but it didn’t feel right to me.

Since the Raiders ended up winning, that was clearly the “least bad” result for Jack. He wasn’t going to get paid off by Steve, but his team won, and he wasn’t going to be out anything. 

Even so, I didn’t feel comfortable going back to that restaurant again. I didn’t want to answer questions about “my friend Steve and when was he coming by to pay up.” So, I guess Jack did lose one occasional customer and one occasional friend.

What would you have done? Would you have spoken up at the time? And if so, would it have been in front of both of them or just privately with Jack? Keep in mind that the fact that the Raiders ended up winning is irrelevant to whether I should have spoken up at the time of the bet. When it was time to “do something or not,” the game had not yet been played.

Author’s Note: I recently broke my rule about not getting involved if a family member of mine was taking the worst of it. There was a Caesars Seven Stars party and I got tickets for Bonnie, her sister, and her daughter. I was off at an Improv workshop. The three ladies would have a good time together.  Bonnie had met several of my gambling friends that she liked and many of them would probably be there.

During the evening, Bonnie ran into two of these friends, “Tim” and “Alice.” Tim talked Bonnie into a $3 bet on an upcoming football game. Bonnie came back and told me about her bet with Tim, but she had no idea what team she bet on. She couldn’t tell me which teams were playing, let alone who was favored. Tim sent an amusing email contract using over-the-top legalese documenting the bet. I accepted on Bonnie’s behalf and promised to hold her feet to the fire should she lose.

Turns out that Bonnie’s team was a 1½-point underdog and she was making the bet straight up. While she’s definitely a family member taking the worst of it, I kept quiet. For $3 at a time, getting the wrong side isn’t so terrible.