Values

People need to be weaned off the government teat. This will take time. It won't and can't happen overnight.

Tut - I'm sure there are people who fit the profile you paint. In my experience they are a vast minority. Most unemployed people I meet aren't happy about it...Most Food Stamp recipients aren't content to eat Ramon Noodles the rest of their life. Not in a country that potentially offers so much opportunity.

But you bring up some solid common ground. If there are means by which to weed out people who abuse the system then lets pursue it. Broad based cuts to programs do not achieve this goal. When the amount of food stamps money is cut to recipients you cut it from people who legitimately collect and those who abuse the system. Same for unemployment. Same for disability. Same for school lunches and SNAP.
In the wake of the biggest financial collapse since the great depression I'm willing to err on the side of helping too many people. But if there is a way to kick out the bums then fine.


The thing that bothers me the most is that these types of assistance programs are the favorite target of some people to point as the heart of our country's fiscal issues. Far from it. If we're talking values and money we should all have the courage to look at our national budget and see what are the really big items that affect it and how they all compare in size and consequence. Budgets reflect values. Right now our budget favors corporate and military handouts far more than those of the unemployed/hungry/homeless.

Okay, I've been out of work for over 14 months. It took four months of appealing to get unemployment benefits. The unemployment commission agreed with me that if the company asked me in writing, twice, for my opinion, and then fired me for giving my opinion, that I was due unemployment benefits. A month later I was dropped from the unemployment benefit rolls because I didn't "re-appeal in a timely manner".

Well I didn't re-appeal, because I had just won my appeal! I think the system is broken. And guess what, the unemployment numbers went down by one that day.

There are a number of unemployed out there that don't figure in the numbers because they don't receive benefits. And people at the Workforce Commission agree with me on this point. Some have given up hope and just stopped looking. Others, like me, are continually frustrated we can't find employment.

I have a college degree but when I apply for minimum wage jobs, I never hear back. My belief is that they know I'm looking for a short time fix and will move on if something better comes along. But isn't that what most people do? When I apply for jobs I feel I'm qualified for, I never hear anything either. It's a very frustrating feeling.

Oh, the only assistance I get is food stamps or Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP) which are the same. I haven't reapplied for three months since I had accumulated more food than I could consume. I've actually donated about $250 of food to local food banks and still have money left on my card.

So I told that last church I donated food to that I'm just trying to pay it forward since I have been assisted.

What is your area of expertise, wrosie?

How about prosecuting those that defraud the government and withhold ALL future payments (tax refunds, medicare, social security, SNAP, etc) from these folks until they have repaid what they defrauded from the govenment? How about a 1-800 (whistle blower) number to report those who are defrauding the government anonymously?

After a few prosecutions, I'm sure we would see an improvement in our collective "Values".

It seems like these are "no brainer" steps that could easily be implemented if the government really wanted to get the free loaders "off the dole". But heck, the freeloaders tend to vote for those giving them more stuff so this NEVER would happen.

+1

Don Diego doesn't seem to understand that tax breaks to corporations do not appear as an entry in the federal budget. This is hundreds of billions that federal and state governments should by rights collect from corporations but don't thanks to their effective lobbying.

Why you post that pie chart in response to what pjstroh wrote?

[boldface added - DD]
ii.a. DonDiego presumes pjstroh was talking about "expenditures", not tax breaks, to corporations and the military, . . . because, in fact, 1) tax breaks to either corporations or the military do not appear in the Federal Budget and 2) expenditures e.g. corporate grants and direct spending to the military (some of which also goes to corporations) do appear in the Federal Budget.
ii.a./1/. If by the term "handouts" pjstroh means "tax breaks" the term would make no sense applied to military.
ii.a./2/. If by the term "handouts" pjstroh means "expenditures" it would apply to both corporate spending and military spending.
ii.a./3/. If by the term "handouts" pjstroh means "tax breaks" to corporations and "expenditures" by the military, he would be using quite imprecise language.

iii. Since the discussion was the Federal Budget the topic of tax breaks to corporations was, in fact, only raised by Chilcoot after DonDiego's post, which had nothing to do with "tax breaks".

iv. This is why DonDiego posted the pie chart, . . . to address the values reflected in the budget as raised by pjstroh. QED


There may be individuals who consider "Tax Breaks" to be some sort of phantom revenue which should've been collected but was not because of Government inattention, following which the, presumedly evil, corporations kept it, . . . thereby discomforting all law abiding citizens and starving barefoot children.
This is not so. A tax break is an intentional reduction in the taxes required of specified individuals or businesses or corporations. This tax reduction is generally in furtherance of or response to certain behaviors by the affected parties deemed beneficial to the Country, e.g. investment in capital goods, and always created by appropriate legislation, . . . not some accidental oversight.

Tax Breaks are, indeed, a legitimate topic of conversation, but not the intended topic of this thread.
wrosie explicitly requested the thread not be turned political.
DonDiego suggests Chillcoot initiate a new thread if he thinks the topic is of interest.

Its a fair and accurate chart of the US budget. Food stamps and welfare will be found in the "other mandatory" category along with many other line items. And its true most corporate benefits will be found in the taxcode instead of the budget....which doesnt make them any less relevant to the financial balance sheet of the country